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Home > Archive > Architecture > October 2005 > Proved my case.
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| Last year after Charley, as I drove around the area I saw that many homes
received damaged soffits, panels missing, fascia ripped loose, drip edge
dangling, etc.
So I hired the Master Caulker, my brother, to caulk the joint where the
soffit panels meets the J-Channel, and where the J-Channel connects to the
house walls, all around my house.
Wilma snatched 3 soffit panels loose on the east side of my house.
The panels came loose from where they tuck up above the fascia, but they
stayed connected to the J-channel where my brother had caulked.
(good white silicone caulk, don't remember the brand, I think 3M)
Last year I mentioned in this very group what I was going to do to my home
in this regard.
Now, I am going to hire my brother to caulk the joint where the soffit
panels connect to the (6" aluminum) fascia and I'm going to install the
white nails every 12" around the perimeter of the house that connects the
fascia to the 2x6 barge (sub-fascia).
My investigation shows that the soffit panels came loose from the fascia and
then whipped around in the wind but remained attached to the J channel with
the caulk. If I had installed the fascia nails at 12" o/c and caulked the
soffit/fascia joint I believe none of these panels would have come loose.
Our 6' vinyl fence took the full brunt of the wind from the north.
The wind blew open both side gates and allowed the wind to travel down the
length of the 2 side yards and impact the fence at the rear of the backyard.
My solution for this problem is sort of expensive.
If I was going to stay here I would install all fence panels to the fence
posts with 2 heavy gate hinges on one side and 2 heavy gate latches on the
other side.
In the event of a hurricane I would undo the latches and let the gates swing
free in the wind.
But I would bungee cord the fence panels to keep them from swinging back
against the fence and causing damage.
There are 44 fence panels total.
The hinges cost $11 per pair and the latches cost $8 each, so you can see
this will add up in cost.
But I believe it will lessen the damage in the next hurricane.
If I was going to stay here I would also plant Areca Palms all along the
inside of my fence to absorb the force of the wind.
Hurricane proofing a home must come in steps, small steps, and carefully
observing what has happened and why it has happened, and figuring out a
reasonable cure.
Maybe I should come up with a pamphlet or brochure or something and send it
to FEMA as advice for other homeowners/builders.
| |
| Bob Morrison 2005-10-26, 1:21 pm |
| In a previous post Don wrote...
> My investigation shows that the soffit panels came loose from the fascia and
> then whipped around in the wind but remained attached to the J channel with
> the caulk. If I had installed the fascia nails at 12" o/c and caulked the
> soffit/fascia joint I believe none of these panels would have come loose.
>
Don:
You have provided an excellent example of localized higher than normal
wind pressures due to wind vortexes at places where there is a shape
change. This is addressed in IBC2003/ASCE 7-02 with load factors for
localized pressures running as much as twice the pressures for the
structure as a whole.
Wall corners, rake edges, and eaves/soffits are all subject to this
particular phenomenon.
As for your proposed solution, I concur that a positive connection in the
form of nails or screws painted to match the surrounding surface would add
quite a bit of strength to the soffit panel connection.
--
Bob Morrison, PE, SE
R L Morrison Engineering Co
Structural & Civil Engineering
Poulsbo WA
| |
|
| "Bob Morrison"> wrote
> In a previous post Don wrote...
>
> Don:
> You have provided an excellent example of localized higher than normal
> wind pressures due to wind vortexes at places where there is a shape
> change. This is addressed in IBC2003/ASCE 7-02 with load factors for
> localized pressures running as much as twice the pressures for the
> structure as a whole.
The 3 panels that came loose were about 10-12 feet from the nearest corner
or roof change.
> Wall corners, rake edges, and eaves/soffits are all subject to this
> particular phenomenon.
>
> As for your proposed solution, I concur that a positive connection in the
> form of nails or screws painted to match the surrounding surface would add
> quite a bit of strength to the soffit panel connection.
As I found out yesterday when reinstalling the loosened panels, the aluminum
fascia and soffit is a very light gauge material, nails alone will not hold
this stuff - it will tear loose. The caulk however is a continuous anchor
and if done properly will not allow wind to get behind the material and work
it loose.
(maybe in the future all homes in hurricane zones will be assembled with
continuous beads of glue on the outside) LOL
Having said all of that, the easy solution to the problem of soffits and
fascia's being torn loose is to spend more money.
Surprise, surprise!
I don't like aluminum soffit/fascia, but it is the sort of thing found on
the homes of the lowly drafter type of people.
I bet a 2x12 cedar fascia (anchored 24" o/c w/ (2) 16d ringshanks or (2)
#12x3" galv screws) and stucco soffit with 2" vent plugs would sail through
a hurricane without a problem.
But thats the type of soffit/fascia that is found on the homes of all those
wealthy architects and engineers. :-P
| |
| P Fritz 2005-10-26, 2:21 pm |
| Wealthy my XXX............
"Don" <one-if-by-land@concord.com> wrote in message
news:1xO7f.479$2y.153@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...
> "Bob Morrison"> wrote
fascia[color=darkred]
the[color=darkred]
loose.[color=darkred]
>
> The 3 panels that came loose were about 10-12 feet from the nearest corner
> or roof change.
>
the[color=darkred]
add[color=darkred]
>
> As I found out yesterday when reinstalling the loosened panels, the
aluminum
> fascia and soffit is a very light gauge material, nails alone will not
hold
> this stuff - it will tear loose. The caulk however is a continuous anchor
> and if done properly will not allow wind to get behind the material and
work
> it loose.
> (maybe in the future all homes in hurricane zones will be assembled with
> continuous beads of glue on the outside) LOL
>
> Having said all of that, the easy solution to the problem of soffits and
> fascia's being torn loose is to spend more money.
> Surprise, surprise!
>
> I don't like aluminum soffit/fascia, but it is the sort of thing found on
> the homes of the lowly drafter type of people.
> I bet a 2x12 cedar fascia (anchored 24" o/c w/ (2) 16d ringshanks or (2)
> #12x3" galv screws) and stucco soffit with 2" vent plugs would sail
through
> a hurricane without a problem.
> But thats the type of soffit/fascia that is found on the homes of all
those
> wealthy architects and engineers. :-P
>
>
| |
|
| LOL
"P Fritz" <paulfritzNOSPAMFORME@voyager.net> wrote in message
news:11lvdl1n4rb7iee@corp.supernews.com...
> Wealthy my XXX............
>
> "Don" <one-if-by-land@concord.com> wrote in message
> news:1xO7f.479$2y.153@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net...
> fascia
> the
> loose.
> the
> add
> aluminum
> hold
> work
> through
> those
>
>
| |
| Kris Krieger 2005-10-26, 3:21 pm |
| You have some damn good ideas IMO, Don. I save a lot of your posts. I
never would have thought of this and I betcha that you don't have a lot of
company regarding folks who thought of it.
I bet you could definitely write a book. I dunno about FEMA tho', they
can't even do what they're supposed to be doing now.
Actually, here's another idea (to make some $$, one hopes ;) ):
Interactive CD or CVD presentation.
You write the content. Take some photos maybe.
Your DVD-dood creates or commissions additional illustrations, renders,
etc., organizes your data to optimize it for interactive CD/DVD, structures
the presentation, does the interface, and the other bits of things needed
to create interactive disks.
It can accompany a companion book, or you could offer each separately.
I'd wanted to do something like that as a sort of interactive encyclopedia
of gardening with native plants and their cultivars, but I don't know
"entrepenurial" stuff like marketing or how to get funded or any of that.
But my whole idea would be to make the info (native spp, or hurricane
proofing, or etc.) accessible across a wide spectrum of people. It's an
offshoot of Francis D.K. Ching's great books, where there ilustrations and
the words go hand-in-hand to make construction and other architectural
topics accessible to both pros and lay people. I thik it'd be great to
expand on his idea and offer a variety of images (as above, photos,
schematics, and renders) that compliment, and are complimented by, text.
Another good thing about Ching's books is that the text and images balance
out in terms of quantity/emhasis, AND, even more, his writing style is
intelligent but casual, IOW easily understood, practical, CLEAR.
I think you have a lot of good ideas - a number of the folks here do - and
I think it'd be a *great* idea to create interactive disks with companion
books to present those ideas, bring them to life for a wide audience.
I think it'd also be a lot of fun but I prob. just need a life <LOL!>
- Kris
"Don" <one-if-by-land@concord.com> wrote in
news:a1N7f.444$2y.408@newsread2.news.atl.earthlink.net:
> Last year after Charley, as I drove around the area I saw that many
> homes received damaged soffits, panels missing, fascia ripped loose,
> drip edge dangling, etc.
> So I hired the Master Caulker, my brother, to caulk the joint where
> the soffit panels meets the J-Channel, and where the J-Channel
> connects to the house walls, all around my house.
>
> Wilma snatched 3 soffit panels loose on the east side of my house.
> The panels came loose from where they tuck up above the fascia, but
> they stayed connected to the J-channel where my brother had caulked.
> (good white silicone caulk, don't remember the brand, I think 3M)
>
> Last year I mentioned in this very group what I was going to do to my
> home in this regard.
>
> Now, I am going to hire my brother to caulk the joint where the soffit
> panels connect to the (6" aluminum) fascia and I'm going to install
> the white nails every 12" around the perimeter of the house that
> connects the fascia to the 2x6 barge (sub-fascia).
>
> My investigation shows that the soffit panels came loose from the
> fascia and then whipped around in the wind but remained attached to
> the J channel with the caulk. If I had installed the fascia nails at
> 12" o/c and caulked the soffit/fascia joint I believe none of these
> panels would have come loose.
>
> Our 6' vinyl fence took the full brunt of the wind from the north.
> The wind blew open both side gates and allowed the wind to travel down
> the length of the 2 side yards and impact the fence at the rear of the
> backyard.
>
> My solution for this problem is sort of expensive.
> If I was going to stay here I would install all fence panels to the
> fence posts with 2 heavy gate hinges on one side and 2 heavy gate
> latches on the other side.
> In the event of a hurricane I would undo the latches and let the gates
> swing free in the wind.
> But I would bungee cord the fence panels to keep them from swinging
> back against the fence and causing damage.
> There are 44 fence panels total.
> The hinges cost $11 per pair and the latches cost $8 each, so you can
> see this will add up in cost.
> But I believe it will lessen the damage in the next hurricane.
>
> If I was going to stay here I would also plant Areca Palms all along
> the inside of my fence to absorb the force of the wind.
>
> Hurricane proofing a home must come in steps, small steps, and
> carefully observing what has happened and why it has happened, and
> figuring out a reasonable cure.
>
> Maybe I should come up with a pamphlet or brochure or something and
> send it to FEMA as advice for other homeowners/builders.
>
>
>
| |
| 3D Peruna 2005-10-26, 7:21 pm |
|
"Kris Krieger" <pteroDELETE_THISchromics@earthlinkDELETE.net> wrote in
message news:OvP7f.1786$Rl1.1306@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
> You have some damn good ideas IMO, Don. I save a lot of your posts. I
> never would have thought of this and I betcha that you don't have a lot of
> company regarding folks who thought of it.
>
> I bet you could definitely write a book. I dunno about FEMA tho', they
> can't even do what they're supposed to be doing now.
>
> Actually, here's another idea (to make some $$, one hopes ;) ):
>
> Interactive CD or CVD presentation.
>
> You write the content. Take some photos maybe.
>
> Your DVD-dood creates or commissions additional illustrations, renders,
> etc., organizes your data to optimize it for interactive CD/DVD,
> structures
> the presentation, does the interface, and the other bits of things needed
> to create interactive disks.
>
> It can accompany a companion book, or you could offer each separately.
>
> I'd wanted to do something like that as a sort of interactive encyclopedia
> of gardening with native plants and their cultivars, but I don't know
> "entrepenurial" stuff like marketing or how to get funded or any of that.
Amazon and Cafepress offer options for "self publication" of written and
video material...I think Amazon's is better on the video front...
| |
| Kris Krieger 2005-10-26, 8:21 pm |
| "3D Peruna" <w!h#a$r%o^l&d@w!e#i$r%d&n*e(s)s.com> wrote in
news:GqS7f.837$7s1.168@fe04.lga:
>
> "Kris Krieger" <pteroDELETE_THISchromics@earthlinkDELETE.net> wrote in
> message news:OvP7f.1786$Rl1.1306@newsread1.news.pas.earthlink.net...
>
>
> Amazon and Cafepress offer options for "self publication" of written
> and video material...I think Amazon's is better on the video front...
Ah, I found it - thanks, I never know that was available.
I've known a couple people who did presentations in the past but I got of
touch and don't knwo whether they're still doing that sort of work.
Then there is sales/marketing ... that's a peculiar talent (one which I do
not posess - I always had the lowest numbers - decided I was far better at
being a data weenie).
Practically speaking, a large part of the challenge is the time it takes to
do something like that because of the great many differnt functions
required. Personally, my advantage is that I don't have kids or piles of
relatives demanding my attention. But still, the time has to be taken away
from other things, meaning that one has to hire someone do do those things,
which takes $$. Then there are supplies and possibly software. That also
takes $$.
And if one has to work with others, they have to be paid, plus one has to
accomidate their schedules and backlogs. Again, takes $$.
And if one gets a loan, but the thing doesn't sell (or you don't know how
to market it, same difference), well, you still have to pay back the loan.
It's complex and really easy to get oneself deeply in debt. And if you
have to work with other people...that's its own barrel of worms.
IOW, for a project like that, it's more than finding a publisher - it's
finding the funding. And then managing the project. While trying to avoid
biting off more than one can chew =:-o
Not that the above things are undoable, just that it's too time-consuming
and complex to do gratis.
OTOH for finished things, and smaller projects (i.e. that don't require
funding), the Amazon.com service seems like it could be really nifty, so
thanks for that info 
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