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How good is the teaching of Architecture in China?
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|
| rNdeas@gmail.com 2006-12-09, 9:25 pm |
| Hello fellows!
Do you guys know anything about the level of the teaching of
Architecture in China? Do you know about a good school there? Any known
connections from there with good American/European schools of
Architecture?
What do you guys know think about the idea of studying Architecture
there?
Cheers & Thanks,
rNdea
| |
|
| rNdeas> wrote
> Hello fellows!
> Do you guys know anything about the level of the teaching of
> Architecture in China? Do you know about a good school there? Any known
> connections from there with good American/European schools of
> Architecture?
>
> What do you guys know think about the idea of studying Architecture
> there?
We're still trying to figure out what *architecture* means.
| |
| Michael Bulatovich 2006-12-10, 1:25 pm |
| <rNdeas@gmail.com> wrote in message
news:1165719635.772190.87430@l12g2000cwl.googlegroups.com...
> Hello fellows!
>
> Do you guys know anything about the level of the teaching of
> Architecture in China? Do you know about a good school there? Any known
> connections from there with good American/European schools of
> Architecture?
>
> What do you guys know think about the idea of studying Architecture
> there?
The choice of schools is a complex and personal one. Where are you and what
would be your reasons for attending there? Where would you ultimately hope
to practice?
--
MichaelB
www.michaelbulatovich.ca
| |
|
| > Do you guys know anything about the level of the teaching of
> Architecture in China? Do you know about a good school there? Any known
Sorry, no idea. Wouldn't be surprised if it were a great place to be a
designer right about now. My (all too uninformed) impression is one of
lots of money and building moving around.
> What do you guys know think about the idea of studying Architecture
> there?
I _think_ one is generally better off studying where one expects to
practice. The few "International Design Geniuses" amongst us can just
slap together some great idea and let peons and "architects of record"
flesh out the details. But the rest of us are going to end up needing
to be concerned about local codes and conventions. I remember noticing
(is this actually correct?) once that in the US we seemed to do a lot
more steel frame than Europe which liked concrete. Think I read
something about the strength of the steel unions being involved in
that.
Not that a person can't learn, can't transition, but why force yourself
if you don't have to.
| |
|
| > We're still trying to figure out what *architecture* means.
You make-a me laugh.
| |
| Warm Worm 2006-12-11, 9:25 am |
| gruhn wrote:
>
> Sorry, no idea. Wouldn't be surprised if it were a great place to be a
> designer right about now. My (all too uninformed) impression is one of
> lots of money and building moving around.
Based on the limited material I've read; my trip by car and bus from
Shanghai to Linyi and back again; and relative to Canada and the US,
China is a "mess" in many regards, and full of odd or unexpected
"contraditions".
There are old ladies who often appear to be in their 60's or older,
sweeping the dusty paved streets of downtown Linyi, while BMW's and
Audi's whizz by, alongside young women and men on electric bikes (and
cellphones), the odd old-wooden-trailer-pulling mule, motorized
open-air rickshaw taxis, hoards on all kinds of bikes and motorcycles,
mini three-wheeled cars and pickup trucks, often filled to overflowing
with all manner of produce or mechanical parts, and so on...
Honking the horn is done as a rule (to which practically no one bats an
eye), rather than an exception, BTW, so urban noise-pollution is just
that much more extreme than what a westerner might be used to. Despite
the plethora and cacophony of vehicles-- often going in every which way
that would net a nasty traffic violation in the west-- there were no
rollerbladers, save for me and a rollerblade-class of children and
their instructor encountered one day in People's Square.
Being the only one, and distinctly non-asian-looking among the
overwhelming homogeneity, I was quite a hit! I felt more famous than I
imagine the famous must feel like!
Hello! "Neehaw!"
The feeling I get about the apparent buzz of "money and building" is
one where China has this western ideal (lifestyle?) (that it doesn't
seem to fully understand, and/or properly implement) to play catch-up
with, that the west, itself, has long begun to question, change, and
even give up... And while China does this, it's also utilizing some
very old technologies, such as in the burning of its coal...
I also have a feeling, supported by documentaries I've seen as well,
that it is being taken advantage of by the west, and suspect that the
"money and building" may often be more about being taken advantage of
than about anything else more promising:
http://news.com.com/2100-1040-844195.html
Pepsico, Starbucks, Nestle, Motorola, McDonalds et al. probably don't
want China's true health, well-being and prosperity so much as its
market.
[color=darkred]
I wish I could say that it would be a great idea and opportunity, and
maybe it may still be, but I'm unconvinced, and think that China is
treading a difficult path right now, and getting bad guidance and
influence... and think Confucius would agree.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Confucianism
If one was interested in classical Chinese and asian architecture,
presumably they could still study (and include special courses) in
their home country while taking special semestral study trips abroad to
the countries whose architecture they were interested in.
Good luck!
| |
|
| > Pepsico, Starbucks, Nestle, Motorola, McDonalds et al. probably don't
> want China's true health, well-being and prosperity so much as its
> market.
What a strange thing to say.
| |
| Warm Worm 2006-12-12, 8:25 pm |
| gruhn wrote:
>
> What a strange thing to say.
Relative to what? Life is strange.
| |
|
| "Warm Worm"> wrote
> gruhn wrote:
>
> Relative to what? Life is strange.
Flip it around.
If the chinese people did NOT have health, well being and prosperity then
there would be no market for the companies you mentioned.
Poor people don't buy much stuff.
The magic of the free market, it serves every demand and no one rides for
free.
| |
| Warm Worm 2006-12-12, 9:25 pm |
| Don wrote:
> "Warm Worm"> wrote
>
> Flip it around.
Turn it inside-out.
> If the chinese people did NOT have health, well being and prosperity then
> there would be no market for the companies you mentioned.
I mentioned China's *true* health, well-being and prosperity vis-a-vis
what those corporations *probably* want.
Apparently, a corporation's priority is with profit and/or its
shareholders, rather than with people in general, or even its own
customers, much less their well-being.
> Poor people don't buy much stuff.
But they sure do seem to make a lot of it for practically nothing, ay?
> The magic of the free market, it serves every demand and no one rides for
> free.
You'll have to do better than that to convince me, and based on what I
understand of a free market, and of your opinion over the years, you
don't seem pro free market at all.
As for 'riding for free', if I pick fruit off a tree for sustenance,
then I'm riding for free.
| |
|
| "Warm Worm"> wrote
> Don wrote:
>
> Turn it inside-out.
>
>
> I mentioned China's *true* health, well-being and prosperity vis-a-vis
> what those corporations *probably* want.
> Apparently, a corporation's priority is with profit and/or its
> shareholders, rather than with people in general, or even its own
> customers, much less their well-being.
>
>
> But they sure do seem to make a lot of it for practically nothing, ay?
>
>
> You'll have to do better than that to convince me, and based on what I
> understand of a free market, and of your opinion over the years, you
> don't seem pro free market at all.
> As for 'riding for free', if I pick fruit off a tree for sustenance,
> then I'm riding for free.
Unless you pick them off my tree, then you owe me $2 per. ;-)
I am very pro-free market, and I believe its the only way to have people
free and responsible as long as its not coerced by gov't, which it currently
is.
Saw something on the toob last night that the US *trade deficit* with China
this year was $286bil and wondered why that is considered a bad thing.
**The US bought $286bil MORE stuff from China than China bought from the US.
| |
| 3D Peruna 2006-12-13, 9:25 am |
| Don wrote:
> "Warm Worm"> wrote
>
> Flip it around.
> If the chinese people did NOT have health, well being and prosperity then
> there would be no market for the companies you mentioned.
> Poor people don't buy much stuff.
> The magic of the free market, it serves every demand and no one rides for
> free.
Not only that, but consider this...some corporations are certainly there
for short term gains, but the real money is long term... The
corporations have a vested interest in making sure they have a long term
market, and that requires health and well being.
The other thought, and this is one that most people don't remember, is
that life is always changing. Constants aren't. This is true for
markets and cultures and even the climate (which will change without any
help from you or me).
And, there is the point that the purpose of a corporation is to MAKE
MONEY, not to look after the "true" welfare of the individuals. It is
the INDIVIDUALS responsibility to look after their true welfare (for
instance, we've got 2 McDonalds within 3 miles of where I live, yet I
don't go there more than 1-2/year with the kids--TV ads not withstanding).
Warmwood's statement seems to put the onus on the corporation (or
government) rather than the individual.
| |
| Michael Bulatovich 2006-12-13, 5:25 pm |
|
"gruhn" <gruhn@rararchitects.com> wrote in message
news:1165782466.443124.182790@73g2000cwn.googlegroups.com...
>
> Sorry, no idea. Wouldn't be surprised if it were a great place to be a
> designer right about now. My (all too uninformed) impression is one of
> lots of money and building moving around.
http://www.commentarymagazine.com/c...=10798&page=all
| |
| Warm Worm 2006-12-13, 9:25 pm |
| 3D Peruna wrote:
> Don wrote:
>
> Not only that, but consider this...some corporations are certainly there
> for short term gains, but the real money is long term... The
> corporations have a vested interest in making sure they have a long term
> market, and that requires health and well being.
>
> The other thought, and this is one that most people don't remember, is
> that life is always changing. Constants aren't. This is true for
> markets and cultures and even the climate (which will change without any
> help from you or me).
>
> And, there is the point that the purpose of a corporation is to MAKE
> MONEY, not to look after the "true" welfare of the individuals. It is
> the INDIVIDUALS responsibility to look after their true welfare (for
> instance, we've got 2 McDonalds within 3 miles of where I live, yet I
> don't go there more than 1-2/year with the kids--TV ads not withstanding).
>
> Warmwood's statement seems to put the onus on the corporation (or
> government) rather than the individual.
Warmwood (very warm, very wood) attempts to resist jamming and cramming
complex systems and concepts into tight little idealistic packages,
blurbs, comments or notions. He'd rather leave that to the journalists
and those who quote them.
For the record, I am for a balanced world run by computer. ;)
| |
| Warm Worm 2006-12-15, 5:25 pm |
|
Don wrote:
> "Warm Worm"> wrote
>
> Unless you pick them off my tree, then you owe me $2 per. ;-)
Then you're riding for free and charging me fee. ;)
> I am very pro-free market, and I believe its the only way to have people
> free and responsible as long as its not coerced by gov't, which it currently
> is.
You will likely have to coerce me into paying for the fruit-- among
other things. Then what?
> Saw something on the toob last night that the US *trade deficit* with China
> this year was $286bil and wondered why that is considered a bad thing.
> **The US bought $286bil MORE stuff from China than China bought from the US.
Much of what is traded is garbage...
"Artificial demand constitutes demand for something that in the absence
of exposure to the vehicle of creating demand, would not exist. It has
controversial applications in microeconomics (pump and dump strategies)
and advertising. Synonyms for 'artificial demand' include 'fake demand'
and 'false need'. Vehicles of creating artificial demand can include
mass media advertising, which can create demand for goods, services,
political policies or platforms, and other entities." -- Wikipedia
"The function of a market requires, at a minimum, that both parties
expect to become better off as a result of the transaction..."
--Wikipedia
That's a tall order.
| |
|
| "Warm Worm"> wrote
> Don wrote:
>
> Then you're riding for free and charging me fee. ;)
Not if I bought and paid for them.
>
> You will likely have to coerce me into paying for the fruit-- among
> other things. Then what?
You use coerce, I use convince.
If I can convince you to willingly pay $2 per then we'll both be happy.
If I fail to do that, maybe another person will come by and I'll try again.
Notice I didn't pull my gun and tell you to buy them.
>
> Much of what is traded is garbage...
I won't argue that.
Just look at the landfills.
I do my grocery shopping at a little local store that has just 3 cash
registers.
I was wanting to buy 1/2 gallon of orange juice but the least expensive
choice came in a non-burnable plastic bottle.
All of the containers in cardboard containers cost at least $1 more.
So I bought the plastic bottle.
I wonder what the grocer will say if I show up next week with my squeaky
clean plastic container and ask him to sell me the orange juice without
container?
> "The function of a market requires, at a minimum, that both parties
> expect to become better off as a result of the transaction..."
> --Wikipedia
>
> That's a tall order.
Especially so in a coerced economy where certain entities do not suffer the
repercussions of their actions.
Any inequities you find in the US economy are caused almost surely by the
overbearing hand of gov't and the occaisional shyster.
Ripping people off is bad for ones business.
| |
| Warm Worm 2006-12-15, 8:25 pm |
|
Don wrote:
> "Warm Worm"> wrote
>
> Not if I bought and paid for them.
>
>
> You use coerce, I use convince.
>
> If I can convince you to willingly pay $2 per then we'll both be happy.
That's a big 'if'.
> If I fail to do that, maybe another person will come by and I'll try again.
Assuming he and I aren't already picking fruit off the tree.
> Notice I didn't pull my gun and tell you to buy them.
You didn't need to. We don't recognize your currency, and before you're
finished claiming land and tree and fruit and water as yours, a few of
us already have our guns trained on you... and we're a little hungry.
>
> I won't argue that.
> Just look at the landfills.
> I do my grocery shopping at a little local store that has just 3 cash
> registers.
> I was wanting to buy 1/2 gallon of orange juice but the least expensive
> choice came in a non-burnable plastic bottle.
> All of the containers in cardboard containers cost at least $1 more.
> So I bought the plastic bottle.
> I wonder what the grocer will say if I show up next week with my squeaky
> clean plastic container and ask him to sell me the orange juice without
> container?
How about doing so?
>
> Especially so in a coerced economy where certain entities do not suffer the
> repercussions of their actions.
> Any inequities you find in the US economy are caused almost surely by the
> overbearing hand of gov't and the occaisional shyster.
> Ripping people off is bad for ones business.
What did Paul just say about onuses and the individual?
That's why the world would best be run by computer. ;)
| |
| Roarmeister 2006-12-15, 8:25 pm |
| On 9 Dec 2006 19:00:35 -0800, rNdeas@gmail.com wrote:
>Hello fellows!
>
>Do you guys know anything about the level of the teaching of
>Architecture in China? Do you know about a good school there? Any known
>connections from there with good American/European schools of
>Architecture?
>
>What do you guys know think about the idea of studying Architecture
>there?
I can't personally vouch for any "schools" but I can relate with an
anecdote.
I worked for a company that hired 2 Chinese architects (twin
brothers). They were selected in China by means of a personality /
aptitude test and their career was decided for them. It seems that
most students go through a similar process. Architecture school for
them was a 4 yr degree program which included army training (trained
to prepare for a Taiwan takeover! They were a little miffed when I
told them that Canada had been the first nation in the world that
recognized Taiwan as an independent country...)
They immigrated to Canada to start new careers and initially had some
difficulty because of their broken English. I spent a fair bit of
time with them coaching them on Canadian construction techniques and
drafting and also helped them with understanding English. The one
brother began taking computer science classes in his spare time,
eventually quit and got his CS degree /w Great Distinction. Seems the
great mind set back in China got it all wrong when they choose his
career.
The other continued in architecture but was employed as basically a
drafter. In Canada we have a syllabus program where a technical
school grad can do home training/mentoring to reach the level of a
graduate architect in about 7-10 yrs. The program evaluated his
previous education and work experience and gave him advanced standing
leaving him with about 3 1/2 yrs to obtain the same status. I haven't
seen him in a few years so I don't know what progress he has made
since. Both of them took on Canadian citizenship and as China doesn't
allow dual citizenship they had to renounce. They still travel
internationally but now have the safety of their Canadian passport
instead of their Chinese one.
Their standard and background of construction was in concrete/steel
office towers. I don't know what type of work history they had back
in China and I haven't seen their course syllabus to understand what
type of training they went through.
| |
|
| "Roarmeister"> wrote
I spent a fair bit of
> time with them coaching them on Canadian construction techniques and
> drafting
What is your knowledge of Drafting?
| |
|
| "Warm Worm"> wrote
> Don wrote:
>
> That's a big 'if'.
Been doing it for a quarter century, so its not so big anymore.
>
> Assuming he and I aren't already picking fruit off the tree.
You wouldn;t dare, being honest folks as you are.
>
> You didn't need to. We don't recognize your currency, and before you're
> finished claiming land and tree and fruit and water as yours, a few of
> us already have our guns trained on you... and we're a little hungry.
Then I will pander to reason, surely there is some way we might barter?
If your guns are already trained on me, on my land, then you are already
dead.
>
> How about doing so?
I'm on an increasingly good repoire with the grocer and I may indeed
proposition him so.
>
> What did Paul just say about onuses and the individual?
The only Paul I know is my little brother.
Religious Pauls are specters and are relegated to the UFO bin.
> That's why the world would best be run by computer. ;)
Who would run the computer?
| |
| Roarmeister 2006-12-16, 3:25 am |
| On Fri, 15 Dec 2006 22:03:30 -0500, "Don" <one-if-by-land@concord.com>
wrote:
>"Roarmeister"> wrote
>I spent a fair bit of
>
>What is your knowledge of Drafting?
Well, I graduated from tech school about 23 odd yrs ago after a few
yrs as a labourer in construction. I manual drafted for yrs on
vellum, mylar, bond, sepia and yes even linen! Pins drafted for a
couple years then started doing CAD in '88 and was CADD mgr for a
number of yrs. I was the first one in my community to use paper space
on a regular basis, in fact I forced my consultants to go to PS on a
project because they were still stuck in the "dark" ages.
I draft only about 5% of the time nowadays, too busy managing
projects. I've probably forgotten more about CAD than I want to
admit. :-)
>What is your knowledge of Drafting?
Hmm, but what's that got to do with the original topic?
| |
| Warm Worm 2006-12-16, 9:25 am |
|
Don wrote:
> "Warm Worm"> wrote
>
> Been doing it for a quarter century, so its not so big anymore.
Doing what? Draughting?
>
> You wouldn;t dare, being honest folks as you are.
Being honest and ethical folks, we may feel we have to dare, depending
on you, and the land, food and water that you might claim and charge
for.
There are consequences to "just plopping yourself down wherever you
feel like and doing whatever you want" and those consequences can
include war...
>
> Then I will pander to reason, surely there is some way we might barter?
> If your guns are already trained on me, on my land, then you are already
> dead.
....Case in point.
Reason and unreason can be one and the same.
Often, a compromisal loosening of one's own ideological directives for
another's can work wonders.
>
> I'm on an increasingly good repoire with the grocer and I may indeed
> proposition him so.
Cool... I should try something like that myself.
> The only Paul I know is my little brother.
3D Peruna?
>
> Who would run the computer?
It would run itself. ;)
| |
|
| "Roarmeister"> wrote
> "Don"> wrote:
>
> Well, I graduated from tech school about 23 odd yrs ago after a few
> yrs as a labourer in construction. I manual drafted for yrs on
> vellum, mylar, bond, sepia and yes even linen! Pins drafted for a
> couple years then started doing CAD in '88 and was CADD mgr for a
> number of yrs. I was the first one in my community to use paper space
> on a regular basis, in fact I forced my consultants to go to PS on a
> project because they were still stuck in the "dark" ages.
>
> I draft only about 5% of the time nowadays, too busy managing
> projects. I've probably forgotten more about CAD than I want to
> admit. :-)
Very good.
>
> Hmm, but what's that got to do with the original topic?
I don't know, you're the one that brought up drafting, see above.
| |
|
| "Warm Worm"> wrote
> Don wrote:
>
> Doing what? Draughting?
Convincing people to buy my stuff.
Most have been repeat customers.
I must be doing something right!
>
> Being honest and ethical folks, we may feel we have to dare, depending
> on you, and the land, food and water that you might claim and charge
> for.
> There are consequences to "just plopping yourself down wherever you
> feel like and doing whatever you want" and those consequences can
> include war...
If I plopped myself down any old where there would most likely be (negative)
consequences.
But thats not what I've done.
I practiced a win-win scenario with the previous owner.
He is happy and so am I.
Whom he purchased my land from is not my concern.
>
> ...Case in point.
> Reason and unreason can be one and the same.
> Often, a compromisal loosening of one's own ideological directives for
> another's can work wonders.
If you take my property, that is unreasonable.
If you barter for my property, that is reasonable.
One and the same?
>
> Cool... I should try something like that myself.
>
>
> 3D Peruna?
I remembered that after I hit the send button.
>
> It would run itself. ;)
LOL
What if it got a virus while downloading porn off the web?
| |
| Michael Bulatovich 2006-12-16, 1:25 pm |
|
"Roarmeister" <Ebnezrvfgre2@argfpncr.arg> wrote in message
news:82r6o21ii1qjkfcej780f3qmsfkgshkbvp@4ax.com...
> I was the first one in my community to use paper space
> on a regular basis, in fact I forced my consultants to go to PS on a
> project because they were still stuck in the "dark" ages.
Me too. Now they have layout tabs for the button-clickers, who now can't
figure out how to get more than one sheet in a layout. Oi.
| |
| Warm Worm 2006-12-16, 8:25 pm |
| Don wrote:
> "Warm Worm"> wrote
>
> Convincing people to buy my stuff.
> Most have been repeat customers.
> I must be doing something right!
Good for you and fair enough. (Bear in mind that you're operating in the
current system, which may be a fair compromise... You're probably
happier with it than you realize.) But if you're selling garbage in the
first place and it's ending up in a landfill, and doing all kinds of
wacky things to people and the environment etc., then maybe you aren't
doing many things right. Once that happens, there goes your utopian free
market right down the drain, in part because people *will* step in for
*many* reasons which may not be reasonable to you.
People will argue, protect and rationalize all kinds of things until
they're blue in the face, and dead by their own hands.
>
> If I plopped myself down any old where there would most likely be (negative)
> consequences.
> But thats not what I've done.
> I practiced a win-win scenario with the previous owner.
> He is happy and so am I.
> Whom he purchased my land from is not my concern.
Not yet anyway. ;)
The biggest wars are fought over land and its resources.
>
> If you take my property, that is unreasonable.
Not necessarily.
> If you barter for my property, that is reasonable.
Ditto.
> One and the same?
Sounds like one of those fallacious questions again. 
Mu?
>
> I remembered that after I hit the send button.
Damn send button.
>
> LOL
> What if it got a virus while downloading porn off the web?
It won't get viruses because it will be designed and developed by that
superbuilding guy with the proceeds from his successful Martian development.
| |
|
| "Warm Worm"> wrote
> People will argue, protect and rationalize all kinds of things until
> they're blue in the face, and dead by their own hands.
OK. If not free market capitalism, then what?
| |
| 3D Peruna 2006-12-17, 9:25 pm |
| Don wrote:
> "Warm Worm"> wrote
>
> The only Paul I know is my little brother.
> Religious Pauls are specters and are relegated to the UFO bin.
>
Methinks I've been taken in vain....
>
> Who would run the computer?
Me.
| |
| Warm Worm 2006-12-19, 3:25 am |
| Don wrote:
> "Warm Worm"> wrote
>
> OK. If not free market capitalism, then what?
>
That's the zillion-dollar question...
Maybe constantly-mutating and interbreeding mutations of various
systems-- some new and experimental, some current, and some old.
The future may very well look upon our current systems and ways of life
with great stupefaction.
The childhood fantasy of an ET finding me and beaming me the hell out of
here still manages to resurface.
| |
| shilili1024@gmail.com 2006-12-19, 9:25 am |
|
"rNdeas@gmail.com =D0=B4=B5=C0=A3=BA
"
> Hello fellows!
>
> Do you guys know anything about the level of the teaching of
> Architecture in China? Do you know about a good school there? Any known
> connections from there with good American/European schools of
> Architecture?
>
> What do you guys know think about the idea of studying Architecture
> there?
>
> Cheers & Thanks,
> rNdea
If you have hesitation about learning archi in mainland China. You can
take a try in the university of Hong Kong. And you can access to huge
Chinese market as well there.
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