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Home > Archive > Architecture > May 2007 > What's up with this...?
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What's up with this...?
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| Kris Krieger 2007-04-27, 1:25 pm |
| OK, so, the standard bathroom fan moves, IIRC, about 80 CFM, give or take,
and costs around $70 and sounds a lot like a 747 taking off. IOW, total
POS, but this is what is nearly universal. ((And they never even offer
upgraded fans as an option...))
So, check this out:
http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/items/4WT47
WHy the heck can they make a *computer* fan, which moves as much as this
does, which is also *quiet*, and costs under $30...?
What I'm trying to figure out is how to adapt it to existing bathroom fan
electricity...
But I can't figure out why bathroom fans cost so much for so very, very
little in terms of performance and noise reduction. Captive audience? It
just seems stupid to me, one of thiose things that's done poorly because
"that's how it's always been done"...
- Kris
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| Michael Bulatovich 2007-04-27, 5:25 pm |
|
"Kris Krieger" <me@dowmuff.in> wrote in message
news:7-Odne84tdRso6_bnZ2dnUVZ_qemnZ2d@giganews.com...
> OK, so, the standard bathroom fan moves, IIRC, about 80 CFM, give or take,
> and costs around $70 and sounds a lot like a 747 taking off. IOW, total
> POS, but this is what is nearly universal. ((And they never even offer
> upgraded fans as an option...))
>
> So, check this out:
> http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/items/4WT47
>
> WHy the heck can they make a *computer* fan, which moves as much as this
> does, which is also *quiet*, and costs under $30...?
You're forgetting about the attractive plastic grill, aren't you?
--
MichaelB
www.michaelbulatovich.ca
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"Michael Bulatovich" <Please@dont.try> wrote in message
news:f0tf8801m5s@news3.newsguy.com...
>
> "Kris Krieger" <me@dowmuff.in> wrote in message
> news:7-Odne84tdRso6_bnZ2dnUVZ_qemnZ2d@giganews.com...
>
> You're forgetting about the attractive plastic grill, aren't you?
Yeah, looked real nice.....back in the 50's. heh
I wonder how that Grainger will hold up to high humidity?
But I do understand Kris' complaint.
We have one of those cheezy Broans in one of our windowless bathrooms.
(why in the hell would anyone design a bathroom without a window?????)
I turned it on the day we moved in and heard how loud it was and haven't
turned it on since.
Last year in Lee County FL they started requiring ALL bathrooms to have an
exhaust fan, at least 50 cfm, so the fan companies are making a killing down
there.
Prior to last year the the only baths that required fans were the ones that
didn't have a window.
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| Kris Krieger 2007-04-27, 5:25 pm |
| "Don" <one-if-by-land@concord.com> wrote in
news:f0tguj0l6p@news1.newsguy.com:
>
> "Michael Bulatovich" <Please@dont.try> wrote in message
> news:f0tf8801m5s@news3.newsguy.com...
>
> Yeah, looked real nice.....back in the 50's. heh
> I wonder how that Grainger will hold up to high humidity?
> But I do understand Kris' complaint.
> We have one of those cheezy Broans in one of our windowless bathrooms.
> (why in the hell would anyone design a bathroom without a window?????)
> I turned it on the day we moved in and heard how loud it was and
> haven't turned it on since.
> Last year in Lee County FL they started requiring ALL bathrooms to
> have an exhaust fan, at least 50 cfm, so the fan companies are making
> a killing down there.
> Prior to last year the the only baths that required fans were the ones
> that didn't have a window.
>
OOOooooooohh!!!!! At least a whole whopping 50 CFM!!
=:-p
My current 120mm case fan runs at 79CFM; each of the 3 80mm is IIRC 64CFM.
I dunno what the CPU cooler fan runs at. Point is, it's all barely
audible, as opposed to the bath fan that is loud and works poorly.
Plus, what is the advantage suppsoed to be of using an impeller fan?
It seems to me that a fan wouldn't *have* to tolerate high humidity if it
ran worth a dang. Then too, look at the motors on those things. I had to
replace one and got a good look at the motor (disassembled it). I did not
see anything at all that looked particularly "humidity resistant".
OK, I know that, in the large scheme of things, this is barely a fraction
of ablip <g!> But it's just s pet peeve of mine, because I'm very
allergic to mold and would prefer it if bathroom fans worked decently
without forcing people to pay through the nose for the things...
Maybe I just need to become an inventor <L!>
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| Michael Bulatovich 2007-04-27, 5:25 pm |
|
"Kris Krieger" <me@dowmuff.in> wrote in message
news:h_idnR5X8K_P_a_bnZ2dnUVZ_jWdnZ2d@giganews.com...
> "Don" <one-if-by-land@concord.com> wrote in
> news:f0tguj0l6p@news1.newsguy.com:
>
>
>
> OOOooooooohh!!!!! At least a whole whopping 50 CFM!!
>
> =:-p
>
> My current 120mm case fan runs at 79CFM; each of the 3 80mm is IIRC 64CFM.
> I dunno what the CPU cooler fan runs at. Point is, it's all barely
> audible, as opposed to the bath fan that is loud and works poorly.
>
> Plus, what is the advantage suppsoed to be of using an impeller fan?
>
> It seems to me that a fan wouldn't *have* to tolerate high humidity if it
> ran worth a dang. Then too, look at the motors on those things. I had to
> replace one and got a good look at the motor (disassembled it). I did
> not
> see anything at all that looked particularly "humidity resistant".
I'm not an engineer, but you should check the spec, esp. the assumed static
pressure before trying to use one of these....
--
MichaelB
www.michaelbulatovich.ca
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| 911 Was An Inside Job 2007-04-27, 9:25 pm |
| Who needs engineers or architects or any other licensed fascist pig when all
we need is google?
calculating air flow
Well, let these licensed fascists be reminded everybody that has learned the
truth knows the fascist pigs have officially agreed to remain silent despite
the fact that...
<!-- 911 Was An Inside Job -->
"Michael Bulatovich" <Please@dont.try> wrote in message
news:f0tri6024ts@news3.newsguy.com...
>
> "Kris Krieger" <me@dowmuff.in> wrote in message
> news:h_idnR5X8K_P_a_bnZ2dnUVZ_jWdnZ2d@giganews.com...
>
> I'm not an engineer, but you should check the spec, esp. the assumed
> static pressure before trying to use one of these....
> --
>
>
> MichaelB
> www.michaelbulatovich.ca
>
>
| |
|
| A friend of my sister's neighbor's son said he heard that someone got a
building permit online by doing a google search.
Sounds like google is gonna put me and bazillions of other people in that
line with the buggy whip salesmen.
"911 Was An Inside Job" <911@insidejob.com> wrote in message
news:4632a650$0$5775$4c368faf@roadrunner.com...
> Who needs engineers or architects or any other licensed fascist pig when
> all we need is google?
>
> calculating air flow
>
> Well, let these licensed fascists be reminded everybody that has learned
> the truth knows the fascist pigs have officially agreed to remain silent
> despite the fact that...
>
> <!-- 911 Was An Inside Job -->
>
>
>
>
> "Michael Bulatovich" <Please@dont.try> wrote in message
> news:f0tri6024ts@news3.newsguy.com...
>
>
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| On Apr 27, 2:20 pm, Kris Krieger <m...@dowmuff.in> wrote:
> OK, so, the standard bathroom fan moves, IIRC, about 80 CFM, give or take,
> and costs around $70 and sounds a lot like a 747 taking off. IOW, total
> POS, but this is what is nearly universal. ((And they never even offer
> upgraded fans as an option...))
>
> So, check this out:http://www.grainger.com/Grainger/items/4WT47
>
> WHy the heck can they make a *computer* fan, which moves as much as this
> does, which is also *quiet*, and costs under $30...?
>
> What I'm trying to figure out is how to adapt it to existing bathroom fan
> electricity...
>
> But I can't figure out why bathroom fans cost so much for so very, very
> little in terms of performance and noise reduction. Captive audience? It
> just seems stupid to me, one of thiose things that's done poorly because
> "that's how it's always been done"...
>
> - Kris
As you know, I'm not an engineer or a architect but let me pose a
thought for you. If you put your finger on that fan, it will
instantly stop quite easily. If you put your finger in a bathroom
fan, it'll cut if off. They may both be theoretically pushing the
same amount of air, but the bathroom ran will push against more
pressure (such as the flapper valve). Just a thought
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"Pat" <groups@artisticphotography.us> wrote in message
news:1177731967.668220.144560@h2g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
> On Apr 27, 2:20 pm, Kris Krieger <m...@dowmuff.in> wrote:
>
> As you know, I'm not an engineer or a architect but let me pose a
> thought for you. If you put your finger on that fan, it will
> instantly stop quite easily. If you put your finger in a bathroom
> fan, it'll cut if off. They may both be theoretically pushing the
> same amount of air, but the bathroom ran will push against more
> pressure (such as the flapper valve). Just a thought
Its called *torgue*.
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"Don" <one-if-by-land@concord.com> wrote in message
news:f0v9tv01q9g@news4.newsguy.com...
>
> "Pat" <groups@artisticphotography.us> wrote in message
> news:1177731967.668220.144560@h2g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
>
> Its called *torgue*.
jeezis, I can't even spell....torque.
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| Michael Bulatovich 2007-04-28, 9:25 am |
|
"Pat" <groups@artisticphotography.us> wrote in message
news:1177731967.668220.144560@h2g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
> On Apr 27, 2:20 pm, Kris Krieger <m...@dowmuff.in> wrote:
>
> As you know, I'm not an engineer or a architect but let me pose a
> thought for you. If you put your finger on that fan, it will
> instantly stop quite easily. If you put your finger in a bathroom
> fan, it'll cut if off. They may both be theoretically pushing the
> same amount of air, but the bathroom ran will push against more
> pressure (such as the flapper valve). Just a thought
Not just that, but a bathroom fan has to push a column of air to that flap.
I thought I saw an assumed SP of zero in that spec. The longer the duct the
higher the SP. Zero would be found in a duct of zero length....
--
MichaelB
www.michaelbulatovich.ca
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| On Apr 28, 7:47 am, "Don" <one-if-by-l...@concord.com> wrote:
> "Don" <one-if-by-l...@concord.com> wrote in message
>
> news:f0v9tv01q9g@news4.newsguy.com...
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> jeezis, I can't even spell....torque.
That's good to know. If I'd have know that before, I wouldn't have
this big-XXX cut on my finger. Ouch.
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"Pat" <groups@artisticphotography.us> wrote in message
news:1177771717.197818.207000@p77g2000hsh.googlegroups.com...
> On Apr 28, 7:47 am, "Don" <one-if-by-l...@concord.com> wrote:
>
> That's good to know. If I'd have know that before, I wouldn't have
> this big-XXX cut on my finger. Ouch.
You can take it from me, knowing stuff doesn't prevent one from doing stupid
stuff.
Wanna compare scarz? LOL
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| Ken S. Tucker 2007-04-28, 1:25 pm |
| On Apr 28, 7:23 am, "Michael Bulatovich" <Ple...@dont.try> wrote:
> "Pat" <gro...@artisticphotography.us> wrote in message
>
> news:1177731967.668220.144560@h2g2000hsg.googlegroups.com...
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
>
> Not just that, but a bathroom fan has to push a column of air to that flap.
> I thought I saw an assumed SP of zero in that spec. The longer the duct the
> higher the SP. Zero would be found in a duct of zero length....
I agreed, needs to push possibly from a basement,
through a long 3" duct.
IIRC, the BC specifies a bathroom fan with a given
"sone" level, even if you have a window.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sone
that converts to dBa, for you audiophiliacs.
In the catalogue, $20, 50CFM, 3 sones bathroom
fan.
I guess it's for shower humidity as well as farts.
Ken
> --
>
> MichaelBwww.michaelbulatovich.ca
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"Ken S. Tucker" <dynamics@vianet.on.ca> wrote
> I guess it's for shower humidity as well as farts.
In construction circles its commonly referred to as a fart-fan.
I have no use for em.
I'd like to try one of them ceiling heaters though.
I likes a nice warm baffroom when I get outta the shower.
Heated floor tiles, heated wall panels, towel warmers......mmmm.....
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| Ken S. Tucker 2007-04-28, 5:25 pm |
| On Apr 28, 12:53 pm, "Don" <one-if-by-l...@concord.com> wrote:
> "Ken S. Tucker" <dynam...@vianet.on.ca> wrote
>
>
> In construction circles its commonly referred to as a fart-fan.
> I have no use for em.
> I'd like to try one of them ceiling heaters though.
> I likes a nice warm baffroom when I get outta the shower.
> Heated floor tiles, heated wall panels, towel warmers......mmmm.....
Check the local code, in BC section 9.32.3.3 applies.
It specifies a CFM and a sound level in "sones".
I'd (we) would be interested in what you guys need.
Ken
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| 3D Peruna 2007-04-28, 8:25 pm |
| Pat wrote:
>
> As you know, I'm not an engineer or a architect but let me pose a
> thought for you. If you put your finger on that fan, it will
> instantly stop quite easily. If you put your finger in a bathroom
> fan, it'll cut if off. They may both be theoretically pushing the
> same amount of air, but the bathroom ran will push against more
> pressure (such as the flapper valve). Just a thought
You've got different requirements. Computer fan has no duct work to
push the air through. Try sticking it on a 4" flex duct and see how
much air comes out at 10'. Then bend the pipe a bid. You need a lot
more umphf to get the CMFs through the ductwork (Michael mentioned
something about static pressure...).
Then, there's the humidity. It'll eat electrical stuff up alive if it's
not designed for it.
So...there's a reason you don't have computer fans in bathrooms.
I've got a system were I have one fan in the attic, with dampered vents
to 3 different areas. You don't hear the fan, only have one hole out
the wall and it works well.
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| Michael Bulatovich 2007-04-29, 9:25 am |
|
"3D Peruna" <wharold@weirdness.com> wrote in message
news:UwRYh.74$TL6.14@newsfe03.lga...
> Pat wrote:
>
>
> You've got different requirements. Computer fan has no duct work to push
> the air through. Try sticking it on a 4" flex duct and see how much air
> comes out at 10'. Then bend the pipe a bid. You need a lot more umphf to
> get the CMFs through the ductwork (Michael mentioned something about
> static pressure...).
>
> Then, there's the humidity. It'll eat electrical stuff up alive if it's
> not designed for it.
>
> So...there's a reason you don't have computer fans in bathrooms.
>
> I've got a system were I have one fan in the attic, with dampered vents to
> 3 different areas. You don't hear the fan, only have one hole out the
> wall and it works well.
I did the same with an enormous range hood fan in a custom house...~1450 cfm
max IINM. Very quiet....cats who climb up on the counter would not be a
chronic problem ; )
--
MichaelB
www.michaelbulatovich.ca
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| "Michael Bulatovich"> wrote
> I did the same with an enormous range hood fan in a custom house...~1450
> cfm max IINM. Very quiet....cats who climb up on the counter would not be
> a chronic problem ; )
So, if the fan is powerful enough you could hover a steak over the burner
and do a rotisserie effect?
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| Michael Bulatovich 2007-04-29, 1:25 pm |
|
"Don" <one-if-by-land@concord.com> wrote in message
news:f1267l01f75@news2.newsguy.com...
> "Michael Bulatovich"> wrote
>
> So, if the fan is powerful enough you could hover a steak over the burner
> and do a rotisserie effect?
It was a powerful sucker.
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| Kris Krieger 2007-05-21, 5:25 pm |
| 3D Peruna <wharold@weirdness.com> wrote in news:UwRYh.74$TL6.14
@newsfe03.lga:
> Pat wrote:
>
>
> You've got different requirements. Computer fan has no duct work to
> push the air through. Try sticking it on a 4" flex duct and see how
> much air comes out at 10'. Then bend the pipe a bid. You need a lot
> more umphf to get the CMFs through the ductwork (Michael mentioned
> something about static pressure...).
>
> Then, there's the humidity. It'll eat electrical stuff up alive if it's
> not designed for it.
>
> So...there's a reason you don't have computer fans in bathrooms.
>
> I've got a system were I have one fan in the attic, with dampered vents
> to 3 different areas. You don't hear the fan, only have one hole out
> the wall and it works well.
>
>
I like your idea! I;ll have to save the post - if I can ever find a good
lot (and know I won't be moving withing 2 yrs...), and have a place
designed and built custom, I'll have to remember that. ((Wanna be a
Ducting Consultant? <G!> ))
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