Home Repair forum - Formica over formica?

Author

Formica over formica?

Dave Balderstone

2006-04-05, 12:21 am

The formica countertops in our kitchen are ugly and have some stains.
Replacement is not in the budget.

Is is possible to lay new formica over the existing? I'd want it to
last 5 years.

If possible, what's the procedure? Remove caulking, sand with 80 grit?
60 grit? Apply contact cement, laminate, roll, then trim edges?

Advice is appreciated.

mrsgator88

2006-04-05, 12:21 am

There are ways to get out or reduce many stains in laminate. A lot of elbow
grease (and I think baking soda) is involved. Also, what do you mean by
"last 5 years" - does this mean in 5 years they're ready to be thrown out,
or in 5 years they're just starting to show wear? We sell a lot of Formica
furniture where I work, and putting new laminate over old is a definite
no-no.

It used to be you could go to a home store and buy pre-made laminate
countertops pretty cheap and cut and joing them yourself. Thats probably
the best way, because you'll be paying full retail for raw sheets of
laminate anyways. And also, if you have bullnose edges, you'll need a
special machine to heat and bend the laminate, but this heat would also
cause the original layer of laminate to come off. Have I talked you out of
it yet?

Steve

bambam@nospam.tnx

2006-04-05, 1:21 am

On Tue, 04 Apr 2006 20:32:09 -0600, Dave Balderstone
<dave@N_O_T_T_H_I_Sbalderstone.ca> wrote:

>The formica countertops in our kitchen are ugly and have some stains.
>Replacement is not in the budget.
>
>Is is possible to lay new formica over the existing? I'd want it to
>last 5 years.
>
>If possible, what's the procedure? Remove caulking, sand with 80 grit?
>60 grit? Apply contact cement, laminate, roll, then trim edges?
>
>Advice is appreciated.

I'd rough up the existing counter top, then glue and screw 1/4 inch
plywood on top, then the sheet goods over that.

Ken

Dave Balderstone

2006-04-05, 1:21 am

In article <WqGYf.8480$4L1.6709@newssvr11.news.prodigy.com>, mrsgator88
<nomospam@nomospam.com> wrote:

> There are ways to get out or reduce many stains in laminate. A lot of elbow
> grease (and I think baking soda) is involved.

Not worth it in ths case.

> Also, what do you mean by
> "last 5 years" - does this mean in 5 years they're ready to be thrown out,
> or in 5 years they're just starting to show wear?

In 5 years we'll likely be selling or ready to rip the whole place
apart and do a total remodel. If we sell, the new owners will either
want to rip it all out or will be willing to live with whatever's
there.

> We sell a lot of Formica
> furniture where I work, and putting new laminate over old is a definite
> no-no.

Why? What are the issues? Furniture is different than countertop, no?

I was told at a local home reno store (Rona, here in Canada) that it
was sand and go. I'm (obviously) asking for a second opinion.

> It used to be you could go to a home store and buy pre-made laminate
> countertops pretty cheap and cut and joing them yourself. Thats probably
> the best way, because you'll be paying full retail for raw sheets of
> laminate anyways. And also, if you have bullnose edges, you'll need a
> special machine to heat and bend the laminate, but this heat would also
> cause the original layer of laminate to come off. Have I talked you out of
> it yet?

Not yet. <g>

No bullnose edges, everything is square.

I can replace the counters myself for the cost of 3 sheets of 3/4 inch
MDF, 2 sheets of formica, and a couple of weekends. Maybe $300 Canadian
for materials.

Should I plan to apply heat and lift the old laminate, then sand and
apply the new stuff? That's feasible... It's a small kitchen and I
could probably lift the old stuff in a long day.

Thanks for your feedback and advice, Steve.

djb

Dave Balderstone

2006-04-05, 1:21 am

In article <7jd632lrp30pkh6bomm97c624c8kkkhpmv@4ax.com>,
<bambam@nospam.tnx> wrote:

> I'd rough up the existing counter top, then glue and screw 1/4 inch
> plywood on top, then the sheet goods over that.

Thanks! I'll do some ciphering on that scenario.

mrsgator88

2006-04-05, 1:21 am

>> We sell a lot of Formica
>
> Why? What are the issues? Furniture is different than countertop, no?

No its the same. Too many issues to spell out at this hour. For your
situation it should be fine however.

> No bullnose edges, everything is square.

OK, then we can talk about it.

> Should I plan to apply heat and lift the old laminate, then sand and
> apply the new stuff? That's feasible... It's a small kitchen and I
> could probably lift the old stuff in a long day.

Yes thats the right way. Plan to go through a lot of sand paper, the glue
might gum it up pretty good.

> Thanks for your feedback and advice, Steve.
>
> djb

Your welcome!

Dave Balderstone

2006-04-05, 1:21 am

In article <rRGYf.8486$4L1.1691@newssvr11.news.prodigy.com>, mrsgator88
<nomospam@nomospam.com> wrote:

>
> Yes thats the right way. Plan to go through a lot of sand paper, the glue
> might gum it up pretty good.

Based on your info and the feedback from bambam, I'm thinking at this
point to lift the old formica with heat, scrape the old glue to a
reasonable point, then glue/screw 1/8 inch hardboard or MDF (instead of
the 1/4" bambam suggests) and reapply new formica over that. Not a big
increase in cost, but (it seems to me) a better adhesion on the new
cabinet top.

Waddayathink? A weekend's work (in this kitchen, two countertops), and
maybe $350 in material.

If I'm off-base I'd love to hear why. No sense wasting time and money...

Dave Balderstone

2006-04-05, 1:21 am

In article <040420062146159698%dave@N_O_T_T_H_I_Sbalderstone.ca>, Dave
Balderstone <dave@N_O_T_T_H_I_Sbalderstone.ca> wrote:

> Waddayathink? A weekend's work (in this kitchen, two countertops), and
> maybe $350 in material.

Oops. Less than $350. I was still thinking the 3/4 MDF.

Maybe $200... I'm talking about two 8 foot long countertops.

mrsgator88

2006-04-05, 2:21 am

"Dave Balderstone" <dave@N_O_T_T_H_I_Sbalderstone.ca> wrote in message
news:040420062146159698%dave@N_O_T_T_H_I_Sbalderstone.ca...
>
> Based on your info and the feedback from bambam, I'm thinking at this
> point to lift the old formica with heat, scrape the old glue to a
> reasonable point, then glue/screw 1/8 inch hardboard or MDF (instead of
> the 1/4" bambam suggests) and reapply new formica over that. Not a big
> increase in cost, but (it seems to me) a better adhesion on the new
> cabinet top.

If you're going to layer additional mdf, then you only need to remove enough
glue to hold the MDF in place with new glue.

Be careful if you screw down the MDF however. The screws have to be counter
sunk and you don't have much thickness for that. If the screws aren't
countersunk you'll get pimpling after you lay down the laminate. The
appropriate stapler/nailer _might_ be better, although you don't want nails
are staples to just go right through 1/8" material.

But if you sand down the original substrate enough the new laminate will
hold

Steve

Dave Balderstone

2006-04-05, 2:21 am

In article <QzHYf.66727$dW3.9233@newssvr21.news.prodigy.com>,
mrsgator88 <nomospam@nomospam.com> wrote:

> But if you sand down the original substrate enough the new laminate will
> hold

Sounds good. Thanks again.

djb

twfsa

2006-04-05, 9:21 am

We had new installed over old and it worked fine, the guy sanded the old
before he glued the new down over the old, seems to be holding up fine thats
been a few years now.

Tom

"Dave Balderstone" <dave@N_O_T_T_H_I_Sbalderstone.ca> wrote in message
news:040420062032096115%dave@N_O_T_T_H_I_Sbalderstone.ca...
> The formica countertops in our kitchen are ugly and have some stains.
> Replacement is not in the budget.
>
> Is is possible to lay new formica over the existing? I'd want it to
> last 5 years.
>
> If possible, what's the procedure? Remove caulking, sand with 80 grit?
> 60 grit? Apply contact cement, laminate, roll, then trim edges?
>
> Advice is appreciated.

m Ransley

2006-04-05, 9:21 am

I plan on the same thing and my idea is clean good with alcohol, sand
the formica , contact cement and formica. Dont make a big deal of it.

m Ransley

2006-04-05, 9:21 am

There is No point to removing old formica, or adding thickness with new
wood, or all the added labor.

Bob (but not THAT Bob)

2006-04-05, 4:21 pm

Dave Balderstone wrote:
>
> The formica countertops in our kitchen are ugly and have some stains.
> Replacement is not in the budget.
>
> Is is possible to lay new formica over the existing? I'd want it to
> last 5 years.
>
> If possible, what's the procedure? Remove caulking, sand with 80 grit?
> 60 grit? Apply contact cement, laminate, roll, then trim edges?
>
> Advice is appreciated.

Go to the source:

http://www.formica.com/publish/site...surf%20Tech.pdf

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