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| Prometheus 2005-07-24, 9:04 pm |
| Greetings to the group,
I've never posted here before, but I will be following this with
interest, if anyone cares to reply!
I am an independant (read- unlicensed) contractor in Wisconsin,
previously in Minnesota, that has been doing smaller jobs for private
homeowners, landlords and small businesses for about five years.
Generally I work alone, and have done a lot of work with residential
framing, drywall, trim carpentry and ceramic tile installation.
But as time wears on, I'd like to change my situation, and do things
the right way by finding myself a position as a regular framing or
finish carpenter with a legitimate GC- I figure I can work up from
there, or just stay where I'm at (less headaches that way, I'm sure!)
The only problem is with the applications- I've been working a 2nd
shift job as a steel fabricator for the last couple of years to have
something on paper, and doing my independant construction work during
normal business hours and on weekends. I have a list of satisfied
clients, but I am not confident that my resume and applications are
even getting a second look.
I know that most places will not consider my five years as five years
of *real* experience, but I'd like to think that the three years I did
this as my sole day job was worth something experience-wise, and I'm
wondering what your experiences have been hiring people from the
"wrong side of the tracks" in the construction industry, and how I can
prove myself to a legitimate company- at least to the extent of
getting onto a jobsite, and demonstrating the skills I've learned and
my job ethic. I'm confident I can do the work- it's just a matter of
turning that into an opportunity!
If anyone is looking for specifics, I am 26 years old, located in
Bloomer, WI (near Eau Claire) I have a good car (under warranty for
another five years, no less,) I own my own tools, and I have a good
record at my current *day job*, as well as a squeaky-clean driving and
criminal record. Any job leads or pointers would be greatly
appreciated- carpentry is what I love to do, and I'd like to make it
my *real* job.
I can be contacted directly at jessek@bloomer.net (Usenet e-mail addy
is munged to avoid spam)
Thank you,
Jesse Krenzelok
| |
| clintonG 2005-07-24, 9:04 pm |
| <snip />
Wisconsin does not require a license for contractors. Review these offical
resources [1],[2] to start getting a handle on this context. Some
municipalities and counties may require permits and licenses for 'home
improvement' or contractors who work with concrete for example but that's
about all I've ever discovered as a Wisconsin resident who has owned and
operated a construction industry contracting business.
Note the smaller communities are still America at its best where merit can
still produce results. The rest of Wisconsin like other states has been
infested by anti-American fascist pigs. The cities are cesspools of filth
and corruption and cater to 'diversity' which you want to avoid like the
plague.
If I were you (and I was a couple of decades ago) I would get into school
and learn CAD drafting. Your background will prove invaluable and you will
be way ahead of the girls and the Negros and other 'minorities' who
employers are forced to catering to for political reasons noting I am being
dead serious about the way things really are for those seeking work with
employers in urban regions. There are also too many corrupt employers who
for economic as well as racist reasons are snapping up as many Mexicans who
are here illegally as they can find. The closer you get to the cities this
becomes more evident. Perhaps that is why you moved from Minnesota.
In any event and for whatever reason I recommend CAD drafting as the next
step in your career in the construction industry. You can continue to labor
while you are young and your body can handle it for the next 2-3 years but
by the time you are 30-35 your body will not want to carry sheets of plywood
or drywall up and down stairs and will start telling you each and every day
to stop. CAD drafting will position you to work with professional services
firms of any discipline you choose to work with. Wisconsin still has rather
decent technical colleges despite its decline into the corrupt realm of
diversity.
Your work experience fabricating steel is in demand by architectural and
most certainly structural engineering firms or design-build firms who will
hire you as a draftsman but you have to know CAD to get your foot in the
door. Polish up your arithmetic skills, learn to draft using AutoCAD and
you're all set.
On the other hand, if once in school you get bit by the bug and you come to
understand you really are smarter and more ambitious than you have realized
you may find yourself going for the degree programs that lead to
registration as an architect or engineer. In the long run, having the
license from the fascist police state is the only way to remain employed
when you are older. Given any economy and any demand for services in the
construction industry all others are being made into criminals who work
without a license from the police state or are being unjustly compelled to
'compete' with girls, Negros and Mexicans few to none of whom present any
merit other than their vagina or the color of their skin.
That's all the time I have to respond at the moment...
<%= Clinton Gallagher
METROmilwaukee (sm) "A Regional Information Service"
NET csgallagher AT metromilwaukee.com
URL http://metromilwaukee.com/
URL http://clintongallagher.metromilwaukee.com/
[1] http://drl.wi.gov/index.htm
[2] http://www.legis.state.wi.us/statutes/Stat0443.pdf
| |
|
| - Prometheus -
> I am an independant (read- unlicensed) contractor ...
> But as time wears on, I'd like to change my situation, and do things
> the right way by finding myself a position as a regular framing or
> finish carpenter with a legitimate GC- I figure I can work up from
> there, or just stay where I'm at (less headaches that way,
- Nehmo -
Let’s get this point clear first. Do you want to work for someone else,
or do you want to work for yourself?
--
|||||||||||||||| Nehmo Sergheyev ||||||||||||||||
| |
| Prometheus 2005-07-24, 9:04 pm |
| On Thu, 21 Jul 2005 19:26:25 GMT, "Nehmo" <nehmo54@hotmail.com> wrote:
>- Prometheus -
>
>- Nehmo -
>Let’s get this point clear first. Do you want to work for someone else,
>or do you want to work for yourself?
Ultimately, for myself- but I've got a wife that is hammering at me to
make sure that I work for someone else, she's afraid that we'd be
behind the 8-ball at all times, despite seeing the amount of work I
get from word-of-mouth alone.
So for the time being, I'm just looking for a job with a GC, either as
a subcontrator or regular employee, until I have got all my ducks in a
row, and have done it regularly again for another couple of years.
I'm undoubtedly going to be looking at going off on my own in 3-5
years, but I don't care to get divorced over it right now!
I'm going to be looking into this idea that Wisconsin doesn't require
a license to contract, though- If I can just get insurance and a tax
ID, the wife may just have to suck it up and smile, because we'll do
better in the long run.
| |
| Phil Scott 2005-07-24, 9:04 pm |
| ..
The basic scene is this...if the hiring company is anally
retentive about exactly how long you did what where, despite
your long list of happy customers... they are too screwed up
to consider..
Your problem is in your approach...the resume thang... that
puts you in a 15' tall stack with 500 other guys, most
flakes...they dont have time to even look at the stack.
The way to get hired is call em on the phone talk frankly and
directly with the owner of his foreman... tell them you will
start at whatever they want and in a month will want a pay
raise to the level they pay others for your quality, speed and
ability to schmooze customers... that works.
the resume thing is just a formality... tell them you dont
want to waste any of their time before they talk with you for
30 seconds first... if they are not hiring right today...tell
them you call back later and move on.
Good people are scarce as hens teeth..the good contractors
know it.... it idiots dont and they hire on bogus criteria.
Time on the jobs means very little past a certain point...its
what you can do thats relevant. An offer to start cheap in
order to learn their ropes will pay off for you.
Phil Scott
"Prometheus" <noneofyer@business.org> wrote in message
news:qm0vd19k3kelo8kq47bqfef8eeghq990jh@4ax.com...
> Greetings to the group,
>
> I've never posted here before, but I will be following this
> with
> interest, if anyone cares to reply!
>
> I am an independant (read- unlicensed) contractor in
> Wisconsin,
> previously in Minnesota, that has been doing smaller jobs
> for private
> homeowners, landlords and small businesses for about five
> years.
> Generally I work alone, and have done a lot of work with
> residential
> framing, drywall, trim carpentry and ceramic tile
> installation.
>
> But as time wears on, I'd like to change my situation, and
> do things
> the right way by finding myself a position as a regular
> framing or
> finish carpenter with a legitimate GC- I figure I can work
> up from
> there, or just stay where I'm at (less headaches that way,
> I'm sure!)
> The only problem is with the applications- I've been working
> a 2nd
> shift job as a steel fabricator for the last couple of years
> to have
> something on paper, and doing my independant construction
> work during
> normal business hours and on weekends. I have a list of
> satisfied
> clients, but I am not confident that my resume and
> applications are
> even getting a second look.
>
> I know that most places will not consider my five years as
> five years
> of *real* experience, but I'd like to think that the three
> years I did
> this as my sole day job was worth something experience-wise,
> and I'm
> wondering what your experiences have been hiring people from
> the
> "wrong side of the tracks" in the construction industry, and
> how I can
> prove myself to a legitimate company- at least to the extent
> of
> getting onto a jobsite, and demonstrating the skills I've
> learned and
> my job ethic. I'm confident I can do the work- it's just a
> matter of
> turning that into an opportunity!
>
> If anyone is looking for specifics, I am 26 years old,
> located in
> Bloomer, WI (near Eau Claire) I have a good car (under
> warranty for
> another five years, no less,) I own my own tools, and I have
> a good
> record at my current *day job*, as well as a squeaky-clean
> driving and
> criminal record. Any job leads or pointers would be greatly
> appreciated- carpentry is what I love to do, and I'd like to
> make it
> my *real* job.
>
> I can be contacted directly at jessek@bloomer.net (Usenet
> e-mail addy
> is munged to avoid spam)
>
> Thank you,
>
> Jesse Krenzelok
| |
| Phil Scott 2005-07-24, 9:04 pm |
|
"clintonG" <csgallagher@REMOVETHISTEXTmetromilwaukee.com>
wrote in message news:E1RDe.100$8g.70@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com...
> <snip />
>
> Wisconsin does not require a license for contractors. Review
> these offical resources [1],[2] to start getting a handle on
> this context. Some municipalities and counties may require
> permits and licenses for 'home improvement' or contractors
> who work with concrete for example but that's about all I've
> ever discovered as a Wisconsin resident who has owned and
> operated a construction industry contracting business.
>
> Note the smaller communities are still America at its best
> where merit can still produce results. The rest of Wisconsin
> like other states has been infested by anti-American fascist
> pigs. The cities are cesspools of filth and corruption and
> cater to 'diversity' which you want to avoid like the
> plague.
Spectacular advice...and well stated too, although I dont
see why you held back... 
I myself would very well advised to take your advice also,
but for what ever reason am in SF now.... no
comment...except to say you have if anything understated the
case.
Advice to learn CAD will pay off big time...but its not an end
in itself as you know... we have an influx of chinese and
Indians driving those down... it remains though a crucial
skill.
Ultra high end tech is still good...Honeywell though is
planning import those by the gross from India...India has
world class tech schools (IT is world famous) they work
cheap.
High skills in a small town environment might be the best for
now at least. the licence issue is also a mess as you know.
I got a letter from the state of calif " We KNOW you are a
contractor, your income tax filing is LESS than the state
average... therefore you are to refile showing ALL income or
we will assess you an 800 dollar fine and report that ...etc"
Utter and complete insanity...and its getting worse fast..
unless one has stepped gracefully out of the line of fire.
Dodging that range of bullets is a job in itself and time
consuming...
Phil Scott
>
> If I were you (and I was a couple of decades ago) I would
> get into school and learn CAD drafting. Your background will
> prove invaluable and you will be way ahead of the girls and
> the Negros and other 'minorities' who employers are forced
> to catering to for political reasons noting I am being dead
> serious about the way things really are for those seeking
> work with employers in urban regions. There are also too
> many corrupt employers who for economic as well as racist
> reasons are snapping up as many Mexicans who are here
> illegally as they can find. The closer you get to the cities
> this becomes more evident. Perhaps that is why you moved
> from Minnesota.
>
> In any event and for whatever reason I recommend CAD
> drafting as the next step in your career in the construction
> industry. You can continue to labor while you are young and
> your body can handle it for the next 2-3 years but by the
> time you are 30-35 your body will not want to carry sheets
> of plywood or drywall up and down stairs and will start
> telling you each and every day to stop. CAD drafting will
> position you to work with professional services firms of any
> discipline you choose to work with. Wisconsin still has
> rather decent technical colleges despite its decline into
> the corrupt realm of diversity.
>
> Your work experience fabricating steel is in demand by
> architectural and most certainly structural engineering
> firms or design-build firms who will hire you as a draftsman
> but you have to know CAD to get your foot in the door.
> Polish up your arithmetic skills, learn to draft using
> AutoCAD and you're all set.
>
> On the other hand, if once in school you get bit by the bug
> and you come to understand you really are smarter and more
> ambitious than you have realized you may find yourself going
> for the degree programs that lead to registration as an
> architect or engineer. In the long run, having the license
> from the fascist police state is the only way to remain
> employed when you are older. Given any economy and any
> demand for services in the construction industry all others
> are being made into criminals who work without a license
> from the police state or are being unjustly compelled to
> 'compete' with girls, Negros and Mexicans few to none of
> whom present any merit other than their vagina or the color
> of their skin.
>
> That's all the time I have to respond at the moment...
>
> <%= Clinton Gallagher
> METROmilwaukee (sm) "A Regional Information Service"
> NET csgallagher AT metromilwaukee.com
> URL http://metromilwaukee.com/
> URL http://clintongallagher.metromilwaukee.com/
>
>
>
> [1] http://drl.wi.gov/index.htm
> [2] http://www.legis.state.wi.us/statutes/Stat0443.pdf
>
>
>
>
| |
| Phil Scott 2005-07-24, 9:04 pm |
|
"Nehmo" <nehmo54@hotmail.com> wrote in message
news:BFSDe.109$8g.90@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com...
>- Prometheus -
>
> - Nehmo -
> Let’s get this point clear first. Do you want to work for
> someone else,
> or do you want to work for yourself?
Exactly... a key issue.
> --
> |||||||||||||||| Nehmo Sergheyev ||||||||||||||||
>
| |
| Phil Scott 2005-07-24, 9:04 pm |
|
"Prometheus" <noneofyer@business.org> wrote in message
news:b600e19aj8c07e65fvkjtsm4mmtkt6b9ou@4ax.com...
> On Thu, 21 Jul 2005 19:26:25 GMT, "Nehmo"
> <nehmo54@hotmail.com> wrote:
>
>
> Ultimately, for myself- but I've got a wife that is
> hammering at me to
> make sure that I work for someone else, she's afraid that
> we'd be
> behind the 8-ball at all times, despite seeing the amount of
> work I
> get from word-of-mouth alone.
>
> So for the time being, I'm just looking for a job with a GC,
> either as
> a subcontrator or regular employee, until I have got all my
> ducks in a
> row, and have done it regularly again for another couple of
> years.
> I'm undoubtedly going to be looking at going off on my own
> in 3-5
> years, but I don't care to get divorced over it right now!
>
> I'm going to be looking into this idea that Wisconsin
> doesn't require
> a license to contract, though- If I can just get insurance
> and a tax
> ID, the wife may just have to suck it up and smile, because
> we'll do
> better in the long run.
you have the right attitude, intelligence and verve to do
well regardless...
good luck with your career,
Phil Scott
>
>
| |
| clintonG 2005-07-24, 9:04 pm |
| I agree Phil except this fella has apparently not yet learned a very
important fact of life.
**Do not love your work more than you love your wife (and family) **
I was driven to get my architectural degree. Both my former wife and I met
in college and married. She graduated six months before me. I remained
driven. She was driven herself and she drove all right. She drove the first
brand new car either of us had ever owned right out of my life as I
continued pounding it, working, and going to school with no life for us as
husband and wife when I could have just as easily taken some time to reduce
my schedule to help her readjust to getting employed after graduating.
Prometheus needs to keep this in mind as his comments about his relationship
were a stark reminder of my attitude which I learned the hard way was not in
my best interests so I'll repeat it one more time...
**Do not love your work more than you love your wife (and family) **
<%= Clinton Gallagher
"Phil Scott" <philscott@philscott.net> wrote in message
news:dbp8gq$su6$1@news.tdl.com...
>
> "Prometheus" <noneofyer@business.org> wrote in message
> news:b600e19aj8c07e65fvkjtsm4mmtkt6b9ou@4ax.com...
>
>
> you have the right attitude, intelligence and verve to do well
> regardless...
>
> good luck with your career,
>
>
> Phil Scott
>
>
>
| |
|
|
Prometheus <noneofyer@business.org> wrote:
>Greetings to the group,
>
>I've never posted here before, but I will be following this with
>interest, if anyone cares to reply!
>
>I am an independant (read- unlicensed) contractor in Wisconsin,
>previously in Minnesota, that has been doing smaller jobs for private
>homeowners, landlords and small businesses for about five years.
>Generally I work alone, and have done a lot of work with residential
>framing, drywall, trim carpentry and ceramic tile installation.
>
>But as time wears on, I'd like to change my situation, and do things
>the right way by finding myself a position as a regular framing or
>finish carpenter with a legitimate GC- I figure I can work up from
>there, or just stay where I'm at (less headaches that way, I'm sure!)
>The only problem is with the applications- I've been working a 2nd
>shift job as a steel fabricator for the last couple of years to have
>something on paper, and doing my independant construction work during
>normal business hours and on weekends. I have a list of satisfied
>clients, but I am not confident that my resume and applications are
>even getting a second look.
>
>I know that most places will not consider my five years as five years
>of *real* experience, but I'd like to think that the three years I did
>this as my sole day job was worth something experience-wise, and I'm
>wondering what your experiences have been hiring people from the
>"wrong side of the tracks" in the construction industry, and how I can
>prove myself to a legitimate company- at least to the extent of
>getting onto a jobsite, and demonstrating the skills I've learned and
>my job ethic. I'm confident I can do the work- it's just a matter of
>turning that into an opportunity!
>
>If anyone is looking for specifics, I am 26 years old, located in
>Bloomer, WI (near Eau Claire) I have a good car (under warranty for
>another five years, no less,) I own my own tools, and I have a good
>record at my current *day job*, as well as a squeaky-clean driving and
>criminal record. Any job leads or pointers would be greatly
>appreciated- carpentry is what I love to do, and I'd like to make it
>my *real* job.
>
>I can be contacted directly at jessek@bloomer.net (Usenet e-mail addy
>is munged to avoid spam)
>
>Thank you,
>
>Jesse Krenzelok
>
>
Hello,
Youth is for but a short time: a flower than blooms, then dies all too soon.
Follow the money, honey, while you still can, for retirement is coming sooner
than you think.
Working and providing for yourself and your family to the best of your ability
is "love". Holding back isnot love. If your wife cannot support you in your
youth and strength, youwillnot want her in your retirement, when you are
as poor as she made you.
Make hay while the sun shines. If your wife leaves you and takes half or
better of what youhave made, itwill be best to have it happen now than later
when youare too old and tired to make it all up. You cannot live in fear
and nagging of a selfish wife; it will kill you in the form of a stroke or
heart attack, even obesity or alcohol. How can you fly high and free as an
Eagle when you live with turkey. America's society is based on cash money,
so the more of it you get, the better a citizen you are.
_______________________________________________________________________________
Posted Via Uncensored-News.Com - Accounts Starting At $6.95 - http://www.uncensored-news.com
<><><><><><><> The Worlds Uncensored News Source <><><><><><><><>
| |
| Prometheus 2005-07-24, 9:04 pm |
| On Thu, 21 Jul 2005 15:29:45 -0700, "Phil Scott"
<philscott@philscott.net> wrote:
>The way to get hired is call em on the phone talk frankly and
>directly with the owner of his foreman... tell them you will
>start at whatever they want and in a month will want a pay
>raise to the level they pay others for your quality, speed and
>ability to schmooze customers... that works.
>
>the resume thing is just a formality... tell them you dont
>want to waste any of their time before they talk with you for
>30 seconds first... if they are not hiring right today...tell
>them you call back later and move on.
>
>Good people are scarce as hens teeth..the good contractors
>know it.... it idiots dont and they hire on bogus criteria.
>
>
>Time on the jobs means very little past a certain point...its
>what you can do thats relevant. An offer to start cheap in
>order to learn their ropes will pay off for you.
All right, I got a start on this today- Dropped the resume at the
contractor's house, got directions to the site, then headed out there
to talk to him. Sounds like the guy is going to let me put in a day
or two to see what I'm made of- so as far as I can see (and hopefully
I'm not just being big-headed!) I've got a damn good shot at it.
We'll see, at any rate...
Anyhow, just wanted to follow up and thank you for the advice- I
followed it just about down to the letter, and it sure worked better
than waiting for callbacks. Looks like you might have saved me a lot
of time!
| |
| Phil Scott 2005-07-24, 9:04 pm |
|
"Prometheus" <noneofyer@business.org> wrote in message
news:ik82e11767pm09etpgetl7qfegd5qvc8s8@4ax.com...
> On Thu, 21 Jul 2005 15:29:45 -0700, "Phil Scott"
> <philscott@philscott.net> wrote:
>
>
>
> All right, I got a start on this today- Dropped the resume
> at the
> contractor's house, got directions to the site, then headed
> out there
> to talk to him. Sounds like the guy is going to let me put
> in a day
> or two to see what I'm made of- so as far as I can see (and
> hopefully
> I'm not just being big-headed!) I've got a damn good shot at
> it.
> We'll see, at any rate...
>
> Anyhow, just wanted to follow up and thank you for the
> advice- I
> followed it just about down to the letter, and it sure
> worked better
> than waiting for callbacks. Looks like you might have saved
> me a lot
> of time!
Thats good to hear. But also take Clintons advice re the
wife and family.
Using the strategy we discussed you will do well, but
occasionally go into a situation where you will either be put
deliberately over your head or given a job that there is no
easy fast, impressive or slick solution to... when that
happens, the goal is to learn as much as you can about that
area of expertise before you get blown off... or if its a
disaster job, impossible mess etc. my goal at least is to
learn how to side step it in a way that Im either gone
instantly or I make money with no risk.
However I have found over the years that if its a mess,
usually the people behind it are a mess... and its close to
impossible to come out of something like that clean.
If you see clean work sites, good work, respect demonstrated
all around...thats a good place work or contract with.
read Clintons first post in this thread.. the mean one. Its
right on the money, and crucial to understanding how to
survive and do well these days. we are headed south along
those lines and seeing that and structuring for it is vital.
Phil Scott
>
>
| |
|
|
"Phil Scott" <philscott@philscott.net> wrote:
>
>"Prometheus" <noneofyer@business.org> wrote in message
>news:ik82e11767pm09etpgetl7qfegd5qvc8s8@4ax.com...
>
>
> Thats good to hear. But also take Clintons advice re the
>wife and family.
>
> Using the strategy we discussed you will do well, but
>occasionally go into a situation where you will either be put
>deliberately over your head or given a job that there is no
>easy fast, impressive or slick solution to... when that
>happens, the goal is to learn as much as you can about that
>area of expertise before you get blown off... or if its a
>disaster job, impossible mess etc. my goal at least is to
>learn how to side step it in a way that Im either gone
>instantly or I make money with no risk.
>
>However I have found over the years that if its a mess,
>usually the people behind it are a mess... and its close to
>impossible to come out of something like that clean.
>
>If you see clean work sites, good work, respect demonstrated
>all around...thats a good place work or contract with.
>
>read Clintons first post in this thread.. the mean one. Its
>right on the money, and crucial to understanding how to
>survive and do well these days. we are headed south along
>those lines and seeing that and structuring for it is vital.
>
>
>Phil Scott
>
>
Hello, Phil,
Wrong again:
You tell a young man to turn his back on his livelihood to stay home and
play tiddley winks with the babies and do dishes for the wife, while the
Mexicans leave their homes, their wives, their children, their families,
and their Country to pursue their livelihood: that of taking jobs away from
American men that prefer to stay home and change dirty diapers. If this young
man is to make it, he must do it now, not tomorrow. Right now he wants to
do it for his family, however if the wife destroys the family out of selfishness,
he can do it for himself and his children when they need it the most. Follow
the money, honey, and you can only do that when you are young, strong and
healthy. Right now the babies need the mother; later they will need what
the father has to offer, and under the circumstances of the "down-hill slide",
they will need every cent dad can earn today, as in NOW, for there is no
tomorrow for his children, unless he changes that. A good Bible lesson in
the duties of the wife is what you need, Phil, however i guess youwill never
see it nor anything like it since it isnot in the Talmud.
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| 6ft_tall_and_bulletproff 2005-07-24, 9:04 pm |
| You both are right. You want to make sure you are working for a respectable
contractor. They usually give you 30-90 days probation. Give them the same
You can usually tell whether you like it now, will you be proud of the
finished product, ultimatly how will it affect the wallet and resume.
I moved and started as a concrete finisher, finishers didn't always work. I
then worked as both a finisher and a laborer. I quickly became a site
foreman and then a superintendent.
6'
"Harry" <7957418@127.0.0.1:7501> wrote in message
news:42e15472_1@galaxy.uncensored-news.com...
>
> "Phil Scott" <philscott@philscott.net> wrote:
> Hello, Phil,
> Wrong again:
> You tell a young man to turn his back on his livelihood to stay home and
> play tiddley winks with the babies and do dishes for the wife, while the
> Mexicans leave their homes, their wives, their children, their families,
> and their Country to pursue their livelihood: that of taking jobs away
from
> American men that prefer to stay home and change dirty diapers. If this
young
> man is to make it, he must do it now, not tomorrow. Right now he wants to
> do it for his family, however if the wife destroys the family out of
selfishness,
> he can do it for himself and his children when they need it the most.
Follow
> the money, honey, and you can only do that when you are young, strong and
> healthy. Right now the babies need the mother; later they will need what
> the father has to offer, and under the circumstances of the "down-hill
slide",
> they will need every cent dad can earn today, as in NOW, for there is no
> tomorrow for his children, unless he changes that. A good Bible lesson in
> the duties of the wife is what you need, Phil, however i guess youwill
never
> see it nor anything like it since it isnot in the Talmud.
>
>
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| Phil Scott 2005-07-24, 9:04 pm |
|
"6ft_tall_and_bulletproff" <badman@excite.com> wrote in
message news:JAhEe.310$9y3.15@trnddc06...
> You both are right. You want to make sure you are working
> for a respectable
> contractor. They usually give you 30-90 days probation. Give
> them the same
> You can usually tell whether you like it now, will you be
> proud of the
> finished product, ultimatly how will it affect the wallet
> and resume.
> I moved and started as a concrete finisher, finishers didn't
> always work. I
> then worked as both a finisher and a laborer. I quickly
> became a site
> foreman and then a superintendent.
Thats all good advice particularly about the quality, the
money and what it will do for your resume. All 3 have to be
there.
Phil Scott
>
> 6'
> "Harry" <7957418@127.0.0.1:7501> wrote in message
> news:42e15472_1@galaxy.uncensored-news.com...
> from
> young
> selfishness,
> Follow
> slide",
> never
> ____________________________________________________________________________
> ___
> http://www.uncensored-news.com
> <><><><><><><><>
>
>
| |
| Prometheus 2005-07-24, 9:04 pm |
| On 22 Jul 2005 20:17:54 GMT, "Harry" <7957418@127.0.0.1:7501> wrote:
>Wrong again:
>You tell a young man to turn his back on his livelihood to stay home and
>play tiddley winks with the babies and do dishes for the wife, while the
>Mexicans leave their homes, their wives, their children, their families,
>and their Country to pursue their livelihood: that of taking jobs away from
>American men that prefer to stay home and change dirty diapers. If this young
>man is to make it, he must do it now, not tomorrow. Right now he wants to
>do it for his family, however if the wife destroys the family out of selfishness,
>he can do it for himself and his children when they need it the most. Follow
>the money, honey, and you can only do that when you are young, strong and
>healthy. Right now the babies need the mother; later they will need what
>the father has to offer, and under the circumstances of the "down-hill slide",
>they will need every cent dad can earn today, as in NOW, for there is no
>tomorrow for his children, unless he changes that. A good Bible lesson in
>the duties of the wife is what you need, Phil, however i guess youwill never
>see it nor anything like it since it isnot in the Talmud.
You know, I haven't followed this group much, and I'm willing to bet
I'm going to make a good number of enemies by saying this, but hell,
it's nuts. If you can't earn a living at your trade, it's not the
fault of Mexicans, Blacks, Women, the IRS, Black helicopters, Kung-Fu
Ninja Warriors, Jews or any one else you care to name. When people
fail in this country, it is their own fault- and that's it. I do very
well on my own, and I will continue to do the same regardless of the
circumstances. I'm just looking for a way to learn a little more and
move into a larger venue. I started out in the Twin Cities, and yes,
there were Mexican roofers and carpenters all over the place- but they
never, repeat, never caused a situation that prevented me from earning
my living, or even really cramped my style.
Some of you guys get on a mom, apple-pie, and Jesus kick about how
white anglo-saxon men are the only ones who can put in an honest day's
work, but that's bullshit. Every single one of us was an immigrant at
some point in the history of the US, unless you're a native indian-
and not one of the groups that has entered these borders has managed
to destroy the idea on which this country was founded- capitalism. A
hundred years ago, you'd be bitching and whining about how the dirty
Irish were stealing your jobs, but now a lot of you are likely to have
some of that blood yourselves. A hundred years from now, it'll
probably be a bunch of half or quarter blooded mexicans whining about
how the damn (insert some other race/nationality/gender/creed here)
took all the jobs- in other words, nothing will have changed.
Everybody has the ability to work or not to work, and it's got nothing
at all to do with skin color or point of origin- it's just a matter of
desire.
If you want to make a success of your work, do it right, and do it at
a competitive price. Just because you want to make ten million
dollars a year putting up garages, and a guy named Jose is willing to
only make $40-50k to do it doesn't make him wrong- it just makes him
able to beat your bid. Sucks to be you, but no one promised you a
free lunch. Do your job, do it right, use the right materials, and
get it done on time, and people keep coming back for more. Build your
jobs using half-assed MDF and cardboard with smeared-in caulk for
finish joinery, then charge a 200% markup for your superior attitude
and watch the Mexicans take your job because they're doing the same
shit for less money, and that's your own damn fault. There is no
excuse to fail, it's just racist whining. Same thing with the
manufacturing industry- if China wins, don't get mad at them, get mad
at the guys who look and sound just like you that followed the take
the money and run philosophy and sold them all the tools and
knowledge. There is no reason to fail there, either.
Come to think of it, maybe I had better just stick with working for
myself, because I am just sick and tired of hearing this tired old
shit. Buck up or crawl off and die- those are your options.
| |
| clintonG 2005-07-24, 9:04 pm |
| <snip />
You're missing the point dude. Its not about racism. Its about fascism.
Working side by side a man is one thing. Being ordered by a government that
is indistinguishable from a business competitor is another. My company began
to excel until I started being told what to do, when to do it, how to do it,
who to hire and who not to hire. On more than one occassion I was told right
out that failing to obey would result in not getting any work and damn if
that ain't the way the real world really works.
That and more is what you will apparently have to learn the hard way once
you dare step up from your current role as a peon if you begin to pose a
threat as a legitimate competitor to those controlling the cities.
So since you got it and us all figured out go have at it.
<%= Clinton Gallagher
| |
| kzinNOSPAM99@yahoo.com 2005-07-24, 9:04 pm |
|
On 23-Jul-2005, "clintonG" <csgallagher@REMOVETHISTEXTmetromilwaukee.com> wrote:
> Working side by side a man is one thing. Being ordered by a government that
> is indistinguishable from a business competitor is another. My company began
> to excel until I started being told what to do, when to do it, how to do it,
> who to hire and who not to hire. On more than one occassion I was told right
> out that failing to obey would result in not getting any work and damn if
> that ain't the way the real world really works.
some further details would be of interest.
ml
| |
|
|
kzinNOSPAM99@yahoo.com wrote:
>
>On 23-Jul-2005, "clintonG" <csgallagher@REMOVETHISTEXTmetromilwaukee.com>
wrote:
>
that[color=darkred]
began[color=darkred]
do it,[color=darkred]
right[color=darkred]
if[color=darkred]
>
>some further details would be of interest.
>ml
>
>
Hello,
Sounds as if you work for our Corporate-Society-owned Govt. Just think how
lucky you are that you didnot hire on as one of their Mercenaries to get
your legs and arms blown off, who had no choice but todo so, because Corporate-Society-owned
Govt. sent all our jobs over and away to Mexico, China etc., then send us
the never-ending bill, while giving what stinky jobs are left, to the Mexicans,
who want to make America into Mexico - like it was back in good old Mexico
- make it homey like: as in chickens in the bedroom (the Mexican breakfast
in bed (raw eggs are good for hangover)). I have a forefather who fought
in the Mexican/American "War", so would you like to know how i feel about
what Bush, whose brother married a Mexican, because he couldnot find an American
girl good enough for him, since they all have bloodlines tied into Mexico,
is doing to my Country right now???!!!!
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| Phil Scott 2005-07-24, 9:04 pm |
|
"clintonG" <csgallagher@REMOVETHISTEXTmetromilwaukee.com>
wrote in message news:LVuEe.271$8g.70@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com...
> <snip />
>
> You're missing the point dude. Its not about racism. Its
> about fascism.
>
> Working side by side a man is one thing. Being ordered by a
> government that is indistinguishable from a business
> competitor is another. My company began to excel until I
> started being told what to do, when to do it, how to do it,
> who to hire and who not to hire. On more than one occassion
> I was told right out that failing to obey would result in
> not getting any work and damn if that ain't the way the real
> world really works.
>
> That and more is what you will apparently have to learn the
> hard way once you dare step up from your current role as a
> peon if you begin to pose a threat as a legitimate
> competitor to those controlling the cities.
>
> So since you got it and us all figured out go have at it.
>
> <%= Clinton Gallagher
Along those lines but focusing primarily on the home of the
brave and its spawn, the Super Corporation..
..
..
We have in the US a management and behind the scenes moneyed
class that can afford to do without services by various means
temporarily...that leverage is used to offer progressively
lower compensation to producers...driving wages continuously
south.
These do this... not from evil intent, but to compete with
each other out of greed, to beat the bottom line and expand
the business. About the same as most cancers do in any
living organism.
Those cells living as part of the cancer are themselves
malignant.
One has personal choices in those regards. Maybe thats one of
our greatest opportunities as humans... to be, or not to
be..part of that sort of thing.
SBC bell, DSL service went from 59 dollars to 14 dollars a
month over a 3 year period.. as the dollar lost 30% of its
value...SBC will be driven down to marginal profit levels by
corporate competitors... all involved will do that by
cutting costs, and by gaining efficiency.. and those all tend
to drive down the need for *human labor and skill sets, as
functions are automated etc...this drives down wages...and
renders humanity a disposable commondity.
Sort of like a cancer in a human body renders its host
disposable and wasteable to service the needs of the
cancer...and this goes on..until the cancer sucks all the life
from the body.
Thats the nature of a corporation. Thats its structure and
its charter. to survive. Period. End of charter. No
requirement what so ever to aid humanity. An alien concept to
an inhuman entity of course. the corporation is simply not
human. Not its fault at all. Just a fact.
Mankind as created its own Alien...devouring itself from
within by means of the corporation.
as the wages are driven down ....then all costs must be driven
down in order not to be repressive...but thats not the case...
food, fuel and medicine and real estate are rising at 15% or
for the last 5 years...and wages are stagnant or down.
If you exagerate both trends grossly... you can see where it
ends in various countries around the world, under various
systems of govt. Pure capitalist systems and pure socialist
systems can polarize to the gross detriment of the middle
class.
The upper and lower classes go to extremes. the net result
is that the productive middle class is decimated, that loss of
production decimates govt income, national solvency, and its
military.. . then the nation goes into collapse, looses its
ability to muscle its way around in the world and becomes a
poorer, second rate nation.
Thats the pattern apparently as either reaches its extremes.
Exceptions are govts that do not fund much of a military, and
direct all energy to production, and social welfare...they end
up with a bloated govt at worst... but the lack of waste on a
military allows the nation reasonable prosperity... The
Netherlands are a reasonable example of that today, NZ, and
Australlia and to an increasing extent, China. the socialist
structure sucks enough blood from its corporations to feed the
people. Such a nation does not then enable the super
corporation.
The United States is home to the worlds super corporations.
The USA and Russia are examples of nations decimated by a
rapacious military, attempts to dominate (to secure oil
interests for instance)... The Russians fell first... the US
will fall next. As the Chinese and Indians rise to power. the
super corporations will straddle both worlds.
Since Russia fell first, it is beginning on its recovery phase
as the US declines...we see now Russia aligning with China.
this along with US error and a rapacious military, bloated
govt etc...and a tax rate that has resulted in a baby bust,
and US corporations eating its young, canibalizing themselves
and the US citiznry....will all factor into rough times ahead
for those it feeds on... the producive working class. the
body politic. the body of the nation thus afflicted.
Will this lead to total collapse as some predict? Probably
not. Our agriculture, and energy infrastructure and ability
to build nuclear power plants fast etc..and our geographic
isolation from enemies all mitigate against total collapse.
But a down cycle lasting 50 to 100 years at this point imo is
unavoidable...corporate rapacity will not make it anymore
pleasant.
How will that affect everyone? The lower classes will eat a
little less well and die a little sooner than the upper
classes.. whats left of the middle class will slide by... the
rich will get richer...and progressively less human as they
are coopted by the corporate cancer..these become cancer
cells.. physically healthy... but the disease itself.
For most people the issue will be how to get into or stay in
the middle class. (answer: keep pushing the skills
envelope, or take a mind and spirit destroying civil service
job, or become an entrepreneur and be good at it.).
it will be tough for the US lower classes imho...about half as
bad as the Russians had it. There is a series over the last
month, 3 parts by a Russian journalist on the comparisions at
www.fromthewilderness.com (subscription but the summaries
are free, and in 30 days those go off subscription... accurate
to a very large degree, unnerving...but also imo a bit
exagerated.. and not mentioning as I have here the nature of
corporations as cancerous).
Eventual relief? The next pandemic, routine over world
history. Those take out 25 to 40% of the world population.
The next will leave a wonderland of prosperity...
property values will drop dramatically because of reduced
demand...goods will be cheap because of less demand but
production capacity will still be high because its automated.
How long with that last? Quite a while.
so what is a good plan for a living person?
relax, enjoy, don't worry, stay healthy...dont bleed your guts
for government or any corporation or other interest.
dont get greedy because that ruins you from the inside...let
it roll. You will die sure as hell regardless.
Rich or poor we are all just a micro second away from death on
geological time scales.
If you burn out or turn to stone from being greedy and vicious
in the fight ...you gain nothing, and your immune system will
be weak...(if you are well off and live extra clean your
immune system will also be weak)....
If you relax.. and dont die of old age, and are here for the
next pandemic, and survive...life will be good for you... the
middle and lower classes will tend to survive the next
pandemic to a greater degree than some rich and all very poor
people who are malnurished.
How long will the good times last as far as you are concerned?
A micro second in geogical time.. so enjoy. Because if you do
not enjoy, because you are reacting to some white knuckled
greedy boss, or your own greed, or irritation at an insane
culture...you have lost it all anyway...
Which leaves us what is the purpose of all this? To eat more
than ones neighbor? One can get to 800 lbs that way... a
total victory?
Not hardly.
How about one becomes a super intelligent rapacious corporate
attorney able to devise ways of eviscerating the money and
life from everything in the vicinity? The perfect cancer.
Well fine. Except I've seen such men...the one I met today
looked like an alien with his head clean groomed and jaws like
a grasshopper...somehow that left me revolted to the core.
I know better men...relaxed...in love... kind, decent...
poor...and not so poor... some wise, some not. ..their women
loved them.. some soar on the wind even now...
So what is there then.
well maybe just humble grace..thats not such a bad end game...
or maybe grace and wisdom...an utter pleasure but more than
that beyond words.
It may be that such crosses the threashold of death as well
and does not turn to stone.
The corporate attorney though, at least the one I noticed
today...a strategist with legs like tooth picks, and hunched
over from pouring over documents his entire life.... its not
going to end that way for him.
There is nothing there now, there will be nothing there
later.. except maybe a head like alien... trim looking
though...a grasshopper head, and a 200 dollar haircut ...that
was impressive..
Phil Scott
>
>
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