Building and Construction - Forest Fire Salvaged Timber used for Framing Lumber

Author

Forest Fire Salvaged Timber used for Framing Lumber

Z-Man99@swbell.net

2006-05-15, 1:21 pm

A Dallas, Texas Engineering firm at the request of an insurance
company inspected a residence and with forensic lab testing reached a
conclusion that the lumber used to frame the house had been exposed to
excessive high temperature such as that found in a forest fire, and
the lumber, primarly Douglas Fir, in question was surfaced green and
not exposed to a kiln. Since that date many more homes with the same
degradation has been found. The insurance companies have refused
paying the insurance claim based on the fact that the damage was done
prior to the construction of the homes. The monster, "Weyerhaeuser" of
the lumber industry stepped in to block our legal endeavors when we
started procedures against other lumber companies. When the monster
said "we will fight this all the way to the Supreme Court, we're going
to sue you for millions of dollars in attorney fees and you just don't
have enough money to fight us" could only be taken as a threat and
intimidation. Guy Stephensen, Senior Counselor, of Weyerhaeuser if by
chance your reading this you just might as well go ahead and sue. We
are going to take you to court and notifing the appropriate federal
agencies that we believe crimes have been committed.

Thermal Degradation of lumber takes many years to become apparent
unless you know exactly what your looking for, the lumber industry has
done a very good job of hiding this information. Weyerhaeuser's top
expert, David Gromala and Guy Stephensen did their best to BS their
way while inspecting attics in the Dallas/Fort Worth area.

Someone needs to ask Lennar Homes why they ceased using Douglas Fir
from the Pacfic Northwest and Canada after discovery of possible
afflicted lumber in a home built in 2004 in the Dalla/Fort Worth area.

This message has also been sent to the appropriate federal agencies.

Glenn

2006-05-15, 2:21 pm

I see big tears but it looks like all you want is a chance to sue a big
company. What exactly is your problem? So far you just cried without
saying what the problem is causing. Do you actually have one?

With the info you submitted, I'm for Weyerhaeuser.

<Z-Man99@swbell.net> wrote in message
news:m6ef62puq4sakauf6elripvlfaotovmku7@4ax.com
>A Dallas, Texas Engineering firm at the request of an
> insurance company inspected a residence and with forensic
> lab testing reached a conclusion that the lumber used to
> frame the house had been exposed to excessive high

snip>.

George

2006-05-15, 2:21 pm

Z-Man99@swbell.net wrote:
> A Dallas, Texas Engineering firm at the request of an insurance
> company inspected a residence and with forensic lab testing reached a
> conclusion that the lumber used to frame the house had been exposed to
> excessive high temperature such as that found in a forest fire, and
> the lumber, primarly Douglas Fir, in question was surfaced green and
> not exposed to a kiln. Since that date many more homes with the same
> degradation has been found. The insurance companies have refused
> paying the insurance claim based on the fact that the damage was done

What exactly was the basis of the insurance claim? What actual damage
exists?

> prior to the construction of the homes. The monster, "Weyerhaeuser" of
> the lumber industry stepped in to block our legal endeavors when we
> started procedures against other lumber companies. When the monster
> said "we will fight this all the way to the Supreme Court, we're going
> to sue you for millions of dollars in attorney fees and you just don't
> have enough money to fight us" could only be taken as a threat and
> intimidation. Guy Stephensen, Senior Counselor, of Weyerhaeuser if by
> chance your reading this you just might as well go ahead and sue. We
> are going to take you to court and notifing the appropriate federal
> agencies that we believe crimes have been committed.
>
> Thermal Degradation of lumber takes many years to become apparent
> unless you know exactly what your looking for, the lumber industry has
> done a very good job of hiding this information. Weyerhaeuser's top
> expert, David Gromala and Guy Stephensen did their best to BS their
> way while inspecting attics in the Dallas/Fort Worth area.
>
> Someone needs to ask Lennar Homes why they ceased using Douglas Fir
> from the Pacfic Northwest and Canada after discovery of possible
> afflicted lumber in a home built in 2004 in the Dalla/Fort Worth area.
>
>
> This message has also been sent to the appropriate federal agencies.

James A McGuire

2006-05-15, 3:21 pm

Roof rafters are disenegrating due to an exothermic chemical reaction
that began with exposure to excessive heat. Refer to the Forest
Products Lab for documentation on thermal degradation and chemical
reactions of wood due to exposure to high temperatures. As for I
wanting to sue a big company, NO, all that was wanted was our houses
repaired. Watch the news and the next time you see a report that a
wood structure has gone up in smoke and burnt down like it was built
out of kindiling, well maybe now your getting the idea!

Check David Green's, Forest Product Lab, technical memo of July, 2005.
Oh, bye the way, we were told shortly after the report was issued that
David Greene was no longer at the FPL.

On Mon, 15 May 2006 16:57:12 GMT, "Glenn" <pilcheg@kc.rr.com> wrote:

>I see big tears but it looks like all you want is a chance to sue a big
>company. What exactly is your problem? So far you just cried without
>saying what the problem is causing. Do you actually have one?
>
>With the info you submitted, I'm for Weyerhaeuser.
>
>
><Z-Man99@swbell.net> wrote in message
>news:m6ef62puq4sakauf6elripvlfaotovmku7@4ax.com
>
>snip>.

James A McGuire

2006-05-15, 3:21 pm

The roof rafters and joist have degrade and will continue to degrade
and at some point will reach a point of failure, insurance companies
stated replace to correct the problem.

All are missing a fact here, it was the insurance companies that
identified the problem.

On Mon, 15 May 2006 13:15:00 -0400, George <george@nospam.invalid>
wrote:
[color=darkred]
>Z-Man99@swbell.net wrote:
>
>
>What exactly was the basis of the insurance claim? What actual damage
>exists?
>
>

butch burton

2006-05-15, 7:21 pm

Weyerhauser has lots of experiences with class action suits - they had
a wonderful siding product that fell apart and cost them a bundle - a
friend is now replacing it on his house with Hardiboard Siding. I hate
lawyers with a passion but sometimes they have a definate use.

Wonder how many roofs will cave in as a result of using this product -
other producers have got to have the same problem. Wonder if there is
any way to identify the stuff.

Z-Man99@swbell.net

2006-05-16, 12:21 am

Refer to documentation on thermal degradation which can be found, or
it used to be, in the Forest Products Labratory in Madison, WI..

At about 25 years solid black, oxidized resin, on one side or edge the
other side or edge slight or dark brown, location depends on how the
lumber was cut from the tree.. Research data within the FPL will show
that the reaction moves from the pith of tree to the cambrium. There
are other identifing methods besides this one. Look for acetic acid
destruction.

On 15 May 2006 15:19:41 -0700, "butch burton" <spacetrax@wi.rr.com>
wrote:

>Weyerhauser has lots of experiences with class action suits - they had
>a wonderful siding product that fell apart and cost them a bundle - a
>friend is now replacing it on his house with Hardiboard Siding. I hate
>lawyers with a passion but sometimes they have a definate use.
>
>Wonder how many roofs will cave in as a result of using this product -
>other producers have got to have the same problem. Wonder if there is
>any way to identify the stuff.

2006-05-16, 4:21 pm

I would bet all those trees that were flattened durring mount st hellens
and all the huricanes on the east coast is used for framing lumber

probably all of it has some type of internal stress fractures
breakdown at the cell level that may pass a test but will fail early

<Z-Man99@swbell.net> wrote in message
news:m6ef62puq4sakauf6elripvlfaotovmku7@4ax.com...
>A Dallas, Texas Engineering firm at the request of an insurance
> company inspected a residence and with forensic lab testing reached a
> conclusion that the lumber used to frame the house had been exposed to
> excessive high temperature such as that found in a forest fire, and

Bobk207

2006-05-16, 9:21 pm

Z-Man99@swbell.net wrote:[color=darkred]
> Refer to documentation on thermal degradation which can be found, or
> it used to be, in the Forest Products Labratory in Madison, WI..
>
> At about 25 years solid black, oxidized resin, on one side or edge the
> other side or edge slight or dark brown, location depends on how the
> lumber was cut from the tree.. Research data within the FPL will show
> that the reaction moves from the pith of tree to the cambrium. There
> are other identifing methods besides this one. Look for acetic acid
> destruction.
>
> On 15 May 2006 15:19:41 -0700, "butch burton" <spacetrax@wi.rr.com>
> wrote:
>

How about some links to the reports or some other sources?

Thermal degradation that takes years to develop & manifest?

Sounds a little fishy to me...............let's see some data, let's
see some coroboration by alternative sources?

Convince me with facts.

cheers
Bob

Z-Man99@swbell.net

2006-05-16, 10:21 pm

On 16 May 2006 16:31:56 -0700, "Bobk207" <rkazanjy@gmail.com> wrote:

>
>Z-Man99@swbell.net wrote:
>
>
>How about some links to the reports or some other sources?
>
>Thermal degradation that takes years to develop & manifest?
>
>Sounds a little fishy to me...............let's see some data, let's
>see some coroboration by alternative sources?
>
>Convince me with facts.
>
>cheers
>Bob

Download a copy of the United States Army Corp of Engineers Handbook
for Examination of Wood Structures.

Note that the area of the United States we live in is the Dallas/Fort
Worth, Texas, and we have knowledge that it also exist in Oklahoma and
New Mexico. You can roughly get an idea of the magnitude by checking
the GAO Reports to Congress and the US Forest Service salvage timber
sales reports. Also the Fedral Reserve, Ninth District, Minneapolis,
MN, this is the repository for stumpage fees paid to the U.S.
Government for timber/salvage timber paid for harvesting on fedral
lands.

You can also log onto the BNSF Railroad Website, www.bnsf.com, and you
will find that BNSF shipped 5,000 rail cars of timber from a forest
fire in Arizona with the center of the log destined for framing
lumber.

You can also log onto Weyerhaueser's web site and find that 80,000
3-bedrooms of salvaged timber was recovered from Mt. St. Helens
eruption, make sure you watch the National Geographic Channel which
states the pyroclaustic cloud made the sap in the trees boil. Not sure
that it would boil but for the timber to be under hot ash for a period
of time would make more sense to myself.

Temperatures in a forest fire are usually between 1,400 to 1,800
degrees F. Pyroclaustic cloud is around 800 degrees F.

Just for your curiosity, it has taken us several years to gather the
data and facts. So, it's understandable the doubt.

E-mail me directly and I will advise how to get to the FTP so you can
download what you want.

Placed flat on the floor printed out is roughly 12 feet high.

Z-Man99@swbell.net

2006-05-16, 10:21 pm

On Tue, 16 May 2006 15:10:31 -0400, <moo@anonamoo.com> wrote:

We have never concerned ourselves with downed timber from wind, flood,
ice or hurricane, these methods of salvage do not have chemical
breakdown from thermal exposure. From all information we have reviewed
the downed timber from other than thermal exposure is not an issue.

At the molecular level of lumber you are going to find over a 100
different chemicals along with the hemicellulose and lignin, etc.

>I would bet all those trees that were flattened durring mount st hellens
>and all the huricanes on the east coast is used for framing lumber
>
>probably all of it has some type of internal stress fractures
>breakdown at the cell level that may pass a test but will fail early
>
>
>
><Z-Man99@swbell.net> wrote in message
>news:m6ef62puq4sakauf6elripvlfaotovmku7@4ax.com...
>

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