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Home > Archive > Building and Construction > June 2006 > Ceiling Sheet Rock
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Ceiling Sheet Rock
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| Andy asks:
Is there any special trick to sheetrocking a ceiling so that crack
lines will
not eventually appear ?
I have been doing home projects for 20 years, and every ceiling I
have
done develops line cracks along the joists sooner or later. I cover
them by
putting in faux beams, but I know I must be doing something wrong...
Could those of you with experience in this area please let me know
if
there are any tricks you use ? I do the ceiling about the same as I
do
the walls, with the long side of the sheet rock along the joists, and
tape
and bed using fiberglass tape.....
Thanks for any advice I can use on my next job...
Andy in Eureka, Texas
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| HerHusband 2006-06-22, 1:25 pm |
| > Is there any special trick to sheetrocking a ceiling so that crack
> lines will not eventually appear ?
We did all the sheetrock work in our house and garage. Our house has wood
ceilings, but we did sheetrock the 24'x28' ceiling in our garage, and a
few smaller projects.
I used regular 4x8 sheets of 1/2" drywall with our 16" joist spacing. The
professionals recommend 12 foot or longer sheets, but the smaller sheets
are easier to manage when working alone. I rented a drywall lift to hold
the sheets against the ceiling while I screwed them in place.
(I would use 5/8" drywall if your joists/trusses are spaced 24" OC)
I installed the sheets perpendicular to the joists, so the tapered 8'
side of the sheet spans across multiple joists. I used 1-1/4" drywall
screws (not nails) spaced 6" on the edges, and 12" in the center of the
sheet.
We did the ceilings before moving on to the walls, but we installed the
sheetrock vertically on the walls. We found the sheets easier to manage
this way, and all edges were backed by studs.
I applied self-adhesive fiberglass mesh tape across the joints, then used
regular all-purpose joint compound to fill the joint. I kept a
screwdriver in my back pocket, while applying the first coat, to drive in
any screws that protruded slightly.
I used a 6" knife to apply the first coat, then let it dry overnight. The
next day, I used an 8" knife to apply a second coat, and let that dry
overnight. Then I used a 12" knife to apply a final third coat. A few
difficult areas, like the butt joints where two sheets met end to end
required a fourth coat with the 12" knife to get them smooth.
When the final coat had dried a full day or two, I went back over the
joints lightly with a sanding block on a pole. Nothing aggressive, just
knocking off the ridges and smoothing things out. Wear a mask and
goggles, it makes a mess. 
Then I applied two coats of white latex paint (no primer).
The 2x12 ceiling joists in our garage span 24', and have a noticeable
flex when we walk around up in the attic. If any ceiling should crack the
joints, this should be it. But, I haven't seen a single crack in the 5
years since we built the garage.
Many people recommend setting type compounds with fiberglass tape, but
I've always used regular joint compound with great success. Maybe the
setting type drys too hard to flex? Just a guess.
There are only two places (on the walls) I have noticed cracking.
1. In areas where I didn't let the previous coat dry thoroughly before
applying the next coat. This is usually where the joint compound is
thickest in corners, deep holes I've filled, etc.
2. Where the framing was green and the joint cracked when the wood
shrunk. It seems to only occur over doorways or windows where drywall was
pieced in. You could probably avoid this by overlapping a sheet around
the window instead of using small pieces to fill in.
I didn't use any fancy materials. Just the run of the mill stuff you find
at home centers and hardware stores. A few late night runs when we ran
out of supplies...
Anthony
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HerHusband wrote:>
> I didn't use any fancy materials. Just the run of the mill stuff you find
> at home centers and hardware stores. A few late night runs when we ran
> out of supplies...
>
> Anthony
Andy writes:
Thanks for the reply, Anthony, but I pretty much did the same as
yourself except for hanging the panels with the 8 foot side along
the joists...
Over the last 20 years , I have done maybe 4 or 5 ceilings in
various projects, and every one has developed cracks. If the
orientation of the sheet rock is the difference, maybe someone
else will post the reason why.....
Andy in Eureka, Texas
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| One reason may be because rock is stronger if it crosses the
joists and of course staggered joints.
"AndyS" <andysharpe@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1151006915.339146.208710@m73g2000cwd.googlegroups.com
> HerHusband wrote:>
>
> Andy writes:
> Thanks for the reply, Anthony, but I pretty much did
> the same as yourself except for hanging the panels with
> the 8 foot side along the joists...
> Over the last 20 years , I have done maybe 4 or 5
> ceilings in various projects, and every one has developed
> cracks. If the orientation of the sheet rock is the
> difference, maybe someone else will post the reason
> why.....
>
> Andy in Eureka, Texas
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| Wayne Whitney 2006-06-22, 5:25 pm |
| On 2006-06-22, AndyS <andysharpe@juno.com> wrote:
> Thanks for the reply, Anthony, but I pretty much did the same as
> yourself except for hanging the panels with the 8 foot side along
> the joists... Over the last 20 years , I have done maybe 4 or 5
> ceilings in various projects, and every one has developed cracks.
> If the orientation of the sheet rock is the difference, maybe
> someone else will post the reason why.....
WAG--with the long dimension perpendicular to the joists, each joist
has twice as gympsum board wjoints along its length, so for a given
amount of joist flex, each joint has to only flex one-half as much?
Cheers, Wayne
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| crhras 2006-06-22, 5:25 pm |
|
I'm still learning but I remember recently reading that it is best to not
hang the drywall directly on the ceiling joists. If I rememeber corectly,
it was suggested to screw a grid of 1x's perpendicular to the joists and
then hang the drywall on these. If you want, I can probably find the
book/article where I read this. Hope this helps.
Curt
"AndyS" <andysharpe@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1150991329.865103.89820@i40g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
> Andy asks:
>
> Is there any special trick to sheetrocking a ceiling so that crack
> lines will
> not eventually appear ?
>
> I have been doing home projects for 20 years, and every ceiling I
> have
> done develops line cracks along the joists sooner or later. I cover
> them by
> putting in faux beams, but I know I must be doing something wrong...
>
> Could those of you with experience in this area please let me know
> if
> there are any tricks you use ? I do the ceiling about the same as I
> do
> the walls, with the long side of the sheet rock along the joists, and
> tape
> and bed using fiberglass tape.....
>
> Thanks for any advice I can use on my next job...
>
> Andy in Eureka, Texas
>
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| crhras 2006-06-22, 5:25 pm |
|
I remember now it was called "strapping".
Here's a link ...
http://ezinearticles.com/?Strapping-a-Ceiling&id=52613
Damn, I didn't do it in my latest place and now I'm worried...
Hope it helps.
"crhras" <crhras@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:jtEmg.120657$dW3.15180@newssvr21.news.prodigy.com...
>
> I'm still learning but I remember recently reading that it is best to not
> hang the drywall directly on the ceiling joists. If I rememeber corectly,
> it was suggested to screw a grid of 1x's perpendicular to the joists and
> then hang the drywall on these. If you want, I can probably find the
> book/article where I read this. Hope this helps.
>
> Curt
>
>
>
>
> "AndyS" <andysharpe@juno.com> wrote in message
> news:1150991329.865103.89820@i40g2000cwc.googlegroups.com...
>
>
| |
|
| I looked. Bunch of nonsense.
"crhras" <crhras@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:XAEmg.120662$dW3.73401@newssvr21.news.prodigy.com[color=darkred]
> I remember now it was called "strapping".
>
> Here's a link ...
> http://ezinearticles.com/?Strapping-a-Ceiling&id=52613
>
> Damn, I didn't do it in my latest place and now I'm
> worried...
>
> Hope it helps.
>
>
> "crhras" <crhras@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
> news:jtEmg.120657$dW3.15180@newssvr21.news.prodigy.com...
| |
| crhras 2006-06-22, 9:25 pm |
|
Have you done it this way before ?
"Glenn" <pilcheg@kc.rr.com> wrote in message
news:KsFmg.5$Rl3.1@tornado.rdc-kc.rr.com...[color=darkred]
>I looked. Bunch of nonsense.
>
> "crhras" <crhras@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
> news:XAEmg.120662$dW3.73401@newssvr21.news.prodigy.com
| |
| RicodJour 2006-06-23, 3:25 am |
| Glenn wrote:
> "crhras" <crhras@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
>
>
> I looked. Bunch of nonsense.
Why is it nonsense? Maybe you don't see the benefits, or don't think
the benefits are worth the time and expense, but strapping is standard
in some parts of New England. It's a perfectly fine technique with the
usual pros and cons.
On the plus side:
- dead flat ceilings, which is important if there are decorative
coffering, moldings, etc.
- simplifies future wiring (highly recommended for home theater wiring)
- broader fastening surface
On the negative side:
- costs more
- takes more time
- lose 3/4" of headroom
- have to add additional pieces underneath fire blocking.
R
| |
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| We just cut 8' x 3" strips of 1/2 cdx plywood to use for strapping. I think
it comes out a lot less expensive that way.
"crhras" <crhras@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
news:XAEmg.120662$dW3.73401@newssvr21.news.prodigy.com...
>
> I remember now it was called "strapping".
>
> Here's a link ...
> http://ezinearticles.com/?Strapping-a-Ceiling&id=52613
>
> Damn, I didn't do it in my latest place and now I'm worried...
>
> Hope it helps.
>
>
> "crhras" <crhras@sbcglobal.net> wrote in message
> news:jtEmg.120657$dW3.15180@newssvr21.news.prodigy.com...
>
>
| |
|
|
"RicodJour" <ricodjour@worldemail.com> wrote in message
news:1151039061.159922.314880@c74g2000cwc.googlegroups.com >>
>
> Why is it nonsense? Maybe you don't see the benefits, or
> don't think the benefits are worth the time and expense,
> but strapping is standard in some parts of New England.
..
>
OK, maybe I'm wrong. Our craftsmen here in the central states are
good enough with joist spacing that we don't need it. Confess I
can't speak for New England. I'll take your word for it. PS.
You still wind up with the rock going parallel with the joists,
the weakest way. We use up to 16' which gives fewer butt joints.
| |
| RicodJour 2006-06-23, 1:25 pm |
| J.C. wrote:
> We just cut 8' x 3" strips of 1/2 cdx plywood to use for strapping. I think
> it comes out a lot less expensive that way.
There's not much rigidity in 1/2" CDX. I'd be very concerned about
sagging.
R
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|
|
"RicodJour" <ricodjour@worldemail.com> wrote in message
news:1151077730.989092.309150@u72g2000cwu.googlegroups.com...
> J.C. wrote:
>
> There's not much rigidity in 1/2" CDX. I'd be very concerned about
> sagging.
>
> R
>
We put it perpendicular across joists that are 12" on center. It's been 12
years and nary a sag, nor a crack.
--
J.C.
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| bill allemann 2006-06-26, 1:25 pm |
| I would guess that running the drywall sheets across the joists is adding a
considerable
bridging effect (like additional joist blocking) to the set of ceiling
joists.
I've done quite a number of ceilings (across joists, no strapping) on old
rehabs
and never had any cracking problems, except on occasional corners joints at
the walls.
bill
"AndyS" <andysharpe@juno.com> wrote in message
news:1151006915.339146.208710@m73g2000cwd.googlegroups.com...
>
> Andy writes:
> Thanks for the reply, Anthony, but I pretty much did the same as
> yourself except for hanging the panels with the 8 foot side along
> the joists...
> Over the last 20 years , I have done maybe 4 or 5 ceilings in
> various projects, and every one has developed cracks. If the
> orientation of the sheet rock is the difference, maybe someone
> else will post the reason why.....
>
> Andy in Eureka, Texas
>
>
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| HerHusband 2006-06-29, 9:26 am |
| > I pretty much did the same as yourself except for hanging
> the panels with the 8 foot side along the joists...
> Over the last 20 years , I have done maybe 4 or 5 ceilings in
> various projects, and every one has developed cracks. If the
> orientation of the sheet rock is the difference, maybe someone
> else will post the reason why.....
Maybe I missed it, but is the cracking occurring along the 8' length of the
sheets, or is it occurring where two sheets butt end to end?
When sheets are run perpendicular to the joists, the butt joints are
usually located over a joist (or backed by blocking). If you run them
parallel to the joists, the butt ends may end up unsupported. From what I
remember, the long tapered edges of sheetrock have more paper reinforcement
than the butt ends do. That may allow them to span gaps better without
sagging (i.e. cracking)?
At the very least, I would back up free spanning butt joints with a 1x4 or
something to tie the two sheets together and prevent them from sagging.
I install sheetrock parallel to studs on the walls, but in that case the
ends are fully supported by the top and bottom wall plates.
If the cracking is occurring along the joists, the only thing I can think
is the wood is REALLY green and cracking the sheetrock as it shrinks, or
the joint between the sheets isn't ending up centered on the ceiling joist
(thus inadequate support for the sheet).
Anthony
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