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Home > Archive > UK gardening > October 2005 > Blackcurrants with legs.
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Blackcurrants with legs.
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| I know/knew this was/is not the approved method but with a large,
practically weed free, walled garden, only the blackcurrants were home to
brambles, twitch and nettles. No way to clear them.
As a trial, I planted a row of disbudded cuttings with a 12" leg to
the top buds [terminal bud removed]. They all took, and each plant gave a
1/3 reduced crop BUT three times as many plants in the row~~and not a weed
between them!
I have replaced the row at about ten year intervals as the legs gets a
little elderly and woody.
The currants are much easier to pick, at waist height, and usually
combined with pruning to the aerial cluster and taking those laden branches
to a 'stripper' sitting in a comfortable chair at the end of the row! Those
she doesn't eat [I can't stand them raw] go straight into the freezer with a
good shake-up after a few days. A few green in with the blacks are of no
consequence.
October is the best month to start. I would use no other method. Well
worth a try.
Best Wishes Brian.
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| Jaques d'Alltrades 2005-10-19, 3:21 pm |
| The message <43567d1a_3@mk-nntp-2.news.uk.tiscali.com>
from "Brian" <bflay@tiscali.co.uk--- 'flayb' to respond> contains these words:
> I know/knew this was/is not the approved method but with a large,
> practically weed free, walled garden, only the blackcurrants were home to
> brambles, twitch and nettles. No way to clear them.
> As a trial, I planted a row of disbudded cuttings with a 12" leg to
> the top buds [terminal bud removed]. They all took, and each plant gave a
> 1/3 reduced crop BUT three times as many plants in the row~~and not a weed
> between them!
> I have replaced the row at about ten year intervals as the legs gets a
> little elderly and woody.
> The currants are much easier to pick, at waist height, and usually
> combined with pruning to the aerial cluster and taking those laden branches
> to a 'stripper' sitting in a comfortable chair at the end of the row! Those
> she doesn't eat [I can't stand them raw] go straight into the freezer with a
> good shake-up after a few days. A few green in with the blacks are of no
> consequence.
> October is the best month to start. I would use no other method. Well
> worth a try.
Standard gooseberries are fun, too. I don't know if the commercially
grown ones are grafted on to any special stock, but I doubt it.
--
Rusty
horrid dot squeak snailything zetnet point co full-stop uk
http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/
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"Jaques d'Alltrades" <rusty.hinge@foobar.zetnet.co.ok> wrote in message
news:313030303230303843569A1A70@foobar.zetnet.co.ok...
> The message <43567d1a_3@mk-nntp-2.news.uk.tiscali.com>
> from "Brian" <bflay@tiscali.co.uk--- 'flayb' to respond> contains these
words:
>
large,[color=darkred]
to[color=darkred]
to[color=darkred]
a[color=darkred]
weed[color=darkred]
gets a[color=darkred]
branches[color=darkred]
Those[color=darkred]
with a[color=darkred]
Well[color=darkred]
>
> Standard gooseberries are fun, too. I don't know if the commercially
> grown ones are grafted on to any special stock, but I doubt it.
>
> --
> Rusty
> horrid dot squeak snailything zetnet point co full-stop uk
> http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/
~~~~~~~~~~
The blackcurrants were not grown as cordons [and cannot be grown as
cordons]~just with a leg. Gooseberries should be grown with a clear leg.
My cordon gooseberries were quite unbelievable and featured in a gardening
magazine. I don't know how to make a picture available~~~ other than sending
to an individual..
Gooseberries are never grafted as they strike so well from cuttings.
Best Wishes Brian.
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| Jaques d'Alltrades 2005-10-19, 6:21 pm |
| The message <43569002_3@mk-nntp-2.news.uk.tiscali.com>
from "Brian" <bflay@tiscali.co.uk--- 'flayb' to respond> contains these words:
> Gooseberries are never grafted as they strike so well from cuttings.
Good. Another Urgler sent me four Worcesterberry cuttings, and I have
high hopes for them: I have kept them well watered and shielded them
from direct sun a bit earlier in the year, and while one lost its leaves
almost immediately, followed three weeks later by the second, the other
two still have most of them, and the stem and buds of all four look
healthy.
--
Rusty
horrid dot squeak snailything zetnet point co full-stop uk
http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/
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| shazzbat 2005-10-19, 7:21 pm |
|
"Brian" <bflay@tiscali.co.uk--- 'flayb' to respond> wrote in message
news:43569002_3@mk-nntp-2.news.uk.tiscali.com...[color=darkred]
>
> "Jaques d'Alltrades" <rusty.hinge@foobar.zetnet.co.ok> wrote in message
> news:313030303230303843569A1A70@foobar.zetnet.co.ok...
> words:
> large,
> to
leg[color=darkred]
> to
gave[color=darkred]
> a
> weed
> gets a
usually[color=darkred]
> branches
> Those
> with a
no[color=darkred]
> Well
I saw something on TV the other day in which it was said that goosegogs were
grown standard fashion to get them up into the wind to avoid sawfly
problems. Apparently sawfly don't like windy conditions.
Incidentally, is it possible to get thornless varieties of gooseberry? I get
sick and tired of being scratched to bits. I replaced the blackberries on
the allotment with thornless, and it was well worth it, not only thornless,
but bigger and better shaped fruits than the wild ones.
Steve
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"Jaques d'Alltrades" <rusty.hinge@foobar.zetnet.co.ok> wrote in message
news:31303030323030384356BB4C20@foobar.zetnet.co.ok...
> The message <43569002_3@mk-nntp-2.news.uk.tiscali.com>
> from "Brian" <bflay@tiscali.co.uk--- 'flayb' to respond> contains these
words:
>
cuttings.[color=darkred]
>
> Good. Another Urgler sent me four Worcesterberry cuttings, and I have
> high hopes for them: I have kept them well watered and shielded them
> from direct sun a bit earlier in the year, and while one lost its leaves
> almost immediately, followed three weeks later by the second, the other
> two still have most of them, and the stem and buds of all four look
> healthy.
>
> --
> Rusty
> horrid dot squeak snailything zetnet point co full-stop uk
> http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Take care! Loss of leaves is a 'growing' process. It takes growth to
make leaves fall. Leaves on a dead branch might rot but they don't fall. The
earliest to have lost leaves might be the most viable.
Best Wishes Brian.
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| Jaques d'Alltrades 2005-10-19, 9:21 pm |
| The message <4356c5c5$1_2@mk-nntp-2.news.uk.tiscali.com>
from "Brian" <bflay@tiscali.co.uk--- 'flayb' to respond> contains these words:
> Take care! Loss of leaves is a 'growing' process. It takes growth to
> make leaves fall. Leaves on a dead branch might rot but they don't fall. The
> earliest to have lost leaves might be the most viable.
I know why - the first one to drop leaves was just beginning to harden,
and the second one showed signs of browning near the cut. The other two
were quite green.
The autumnal processes had started, and I'd wager they would have
dropped leaves if they'd been left on the bush. The other two are
showing no signs of the leaves dying, still less rotting.
--
Rusty
horrid dot squeak snailything zetnet point co full-stop uk
http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/
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| On Wed, 19 Oct 2005 19:27:01 +0100, "Brian" wrote:
> Gooseberries are never grafted as they strike so well from cuttings.
> Best Wishes Brian.
They do strike well from cuttings, I agree.
But just for interest , Duncan Gillespie in "The Winemakers Garden"
c.1971
Says, of the"hairy grape" or "green grozzet", :-
" Keen gardeners may try to grow their own goosberry standards from
good strong goosberry cuttings",,,
( I agree, I have done it),,,
"commercial goosberry standards are budded on a rootstock of Golden
Current (ribes aurium ), sometimes known as Buffalo Current"
etc etc more quote if anyone wants ,
So whatis ribes aurium ( his capitalisation, or lack of) and wheredoes
one get it from ?
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| Jaques d'Alltrades 2005-10-20, 12:21 pm |
| The message <435719b7.23091388@text.news.ntlworld.com>
from please@dontspam.nothere.com (WaltA) contains these words:
> On Wed, 19 Oct 2005 19:27:01 +0100, "Brian" wrote:
[color=darkred]
> They do strike well from cuttings, I agree.
> But just for interest , Duncan Gillespie in "The Winemakers Garden"
> c.1971
> Says, of the"hairy grape" or "green grozzet", :-
> " Keen gardeners may try to grow their own goosberry standards from
> good strong goosberry cuttings",,,
> ( I agree, I have done it),,,
Good. Let's hope Worcesterberries will do as well.
> "commercial goosberry standards are budded on a rootstock of Golden
> Current (ribes aurium ), sometimes known as Buffalo Current"
> etc etc more quote if anyone wants ,
> So whatis ribes aurium ( his capitalisation, or lack of) and wheredoes
> one get it from ?
Dunno, but: Want, want, want!
--
Rusty
horrid dot squeak snailything zetnet point co full-stop uk
http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/
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"shazzbat" <shazzbat@spamlessness.co.uk> wrote
<snip>
> Incidentally, is it possible to get thornless varieties of gooseberry? I
> get sick and tired of being scratched to bits. I replaced the
> blackberries on the allotment with thornless, and it was well worth it,
> not only thornless, but bigger and better shaped fruits than the wild
> ones.
Chris Bowers lists a thornless red variety called 'Pax'.
www.chrisbowers.co.uk/currants.asp
--
Sue
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| Rod Craddock 2005-10-21, 3:21 pm |
| "shazzbat" <shazzbat@spamlessness.co.uk> wrote in message
news:dj6ek3$d10$1@news7.svr.pol.co.uk...
> Incidentally, is it possible to get thornless varieties of
> gooseberry? I get
> sick and tired of being scratched to bits.
That's one of the big benefits of growing gooseberries as cordons
(either single or doubles like a 'U' on a short leg)
Much easier to pick and far better quality than you get from a bush.
--
Rod
My real address is rodtheweedygardeneratmyweedyisp
Just remove the weedy bits
and transplant the appropriate symbol at.
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| WaltA 2005-10-22, 12:21 am |
| On Thu, 20 Oct 2005 14:40:50 +0100, Jaques & I wrote:
[color=darkred]
>Good. Let's hope Worcesterberries will do as well.
Have you been growing these for long ? **
I hate to dampen expectations but,,,
If they are the same thing that were 'about' about 25y ago, which some
thought were a cross between a gooseberry and a black current, then
dont waste your time !  ) lol !
Or maybe I just didn't mollycoddle them well enough, but I grubbed
mine out and continued with just black currants and gooseberries.
Even black currants are a bit of a waste of time (>runs for cover !> )
for winemaking unless mixed with blackberries and elderberries
in a ratio of about 1 bc : 5 blackberry :2 eb. by weight.
Even my francofile father-in-law (who thought amateur wine making was
a waste of time) asked for second helpings of that one
>Dunno, but: Want, want, want!
let me know know know if thou findest
** just re-read the thread before posting and I see that they are
quite new to you, having come from another urgler,
so, I wonder which other urgler I am now in botther with for
suggesting that they are a waste of time :-?))
Mind you, they may be a better breed, 25y on ,,,
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| Jaques d'Alltrades 2005-10-22, 9:21 am |
| The message <4359a3b3.5758799@text.news.ntlworld.com>
from please@dontspam.nothere.com (WaltA) contains these words:
[color=darkred]
> Have you been growing these for long ? **
Nope - but I kow a man who has
> I hate to dampen expectations but,,,
> If they are the same thing that were 'about' about 25y ago, which some
> thought were a cross between a gooseberry and a black current, then
> dont waste your time ! ) lol !
Later found to be a species rather than an hybrid...
> Or maybe I just didn't mollycoddle them well enough, but I grubbed
> mine out and continued with just black currants and gooseberries.
> Even black currants are a bit of a waste of time (>runs for cover !> )
You obviously had a) the wrong variety; b) the wrong conditions; c) not
netted them; d) not maintained them.
We used to pick buckets full of the things.
> for winemaking unless mixed with blackberries and elderberries
> in a ratio of about 1 bc : 5 blackberry :2 eb. by weight.
> Even my francofile father-in-law (who thought amateur wine making was
> a waste of time) asked for second helpings of that one
A truly ambrosian wine is elderberries and blackberries, with sloes
added to the nearly-completed wine, when they ripen.
[color=darkred]
> let me know know know if thou findest
OK - but you'll have to remind me of just what I wanted, 'cos I've
forgotten already...
> ** just re-read the thread before posting and I see that they are
> quite new to you, having come from another urgler,
> so, I wonder which other urgler I am now in botther with for
> suggesting that they are a waste of time :-?))
You may well find out...
> Mind you, they may be a better breed, 25y on ,,,
Or I may give the more loving care?
--
Rusty
horrid dot squeak snailything zetnet point co full-stop uk
http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/
| |
| WaltA 2005-10-22, 10:21 am |
| On Sat, 22 Oct 2005 11:39:28 +0100, we wrote:
[color=darkred]
>
>Later found to be a species rather than an hybrid...
Well done that man, you passed the test :-)
Yes, quite so, that is why I wrote ",,which some thought,,"
" A North American species in its own right,Ribes divarticatum"
acording to Gillespie 1971
>
>You obviously had a) the wrong variety; b) the wrong conditions; c) not
>netted them; d) not maintained them.
>
>We used to pick buckets full of the things.
I think I was mostly disappointed by the small size of the berries and
the big size of the thorns but I agree it could have been (a) (b) or
(d)
I dont net my goosberies but still get a good crop off them, even up
to the point of beginning to burst their skins because of ripeness.
But if I leave them till they are falling off with ripeness then they
all quickly vanish.
Perhaps we have dumb (or slow to learn) birds ?
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| Jaques d'Alltrades 2005-10-22, 11:21 am |
| The message <435a29b1.545076@text.news.ntlworld.com>
from please@dontspam.nothere.com (WaltA) contains these words:
[color=darkred]
> I think I was mostly disappointed by the small size of the berries and
> the big size of the thorns but I agree it could have been (a) (b) or
> (d)
> I dont net my goosberies but still get a good crop off them, even up
> to the point of beginning to burst their skins because of ripeness.
> But if I leave them till they are falling off with ripeness then they
> all quickly vanish.
> Perhaps we have dumb (or slow to learn) birds ?
Oh. I thought you were still talking about blackcurrants. I've never
even *SEEN* a worcesterberry. Yet.
--
Rusty
horrid dot squeak snailything zetnet point co full-stop uk
http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/
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| WaltA 2005-10-22, 11:21 am |
| On Sat, 22 Oct 2005 13:44:24 +0100, Jaques d'Alltrades wrote:
>Oh. I thought you were still talking about blackcurrants.
hehee, complex aint it ! :-)))
That was Brian,
my blackcurrant mention was just an aside to see if I could upset
blackcurrant growers as well as worcesterberry growers all in the same
thread :-)
and I blame you for deviating first :-
"Standard gooseberries are fun, too. I don't know if the commercially
grown ones are grafted on to any special stock, but I doubt it."
> I've never
>even *SEEN* a worcesterberry. Yet.
Ah so,
we will return to this next year then,
and in a new thread,
with new subject, lol !!!
chortle.
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| Jaques d'Alltrades 2005-10-22, 1:21 pm |
| The message <435a3efd.1515284@text.news.ntlworld.com>
from please@dontspam.nothere.com (WaltA) contains these words:
> On Sat, 22 Oct 2005 13:44:24 +0100, Jaques d'Alltrades wrote:
[color=darkred]
> hehee, complex aint it ! :-)))
> That was Brian,
> my blackcurrant mention was just an aside to see if I could upset
> blackcurrant growers as well as worcesterberry growers all in the same
> thread :-)
> and I blame you for deviating first :-
> "Standard gooseberries are fun, too. I don't know if the commercially
> grown ones are grafted on to any special stock, but I doubt it."
That's not deviating, that's straight up, guv.
[color=darkred]
> Ah so,
> we will return to this next year then,
No doubt.
> and in a new thread,
More than likely. But we *COULD* spin it out. [45¾]
> with new subject, lol !!!
Chortleberries?
> chortle.
That's what I thought.
[45¾] Just to keep it warm, you understand...
--
Rusty
horrid dot squeak snailything zetnet point co full-stop uk
http://www.users.zetnet.co.uk/hi-fi/
| |
| Anti-Spam 2005-10-22, 6:21 pm |
| The message <4359a3b3.5758799@text.news.ntlworld.com>
from please@dontspam.nothere.com (WaltA) contains these words:
> I wonder which other urgler I am now in botther with for
> suggesting that they are a waste of time :-?))
I'll hold up my hand and say T'was I.
I'm not offended, I am trying them out, and this year we had quite a
good crop. I was trying to find a berry that we had some years back in
another garden, which was similar (but had awful thorns). The worcester
is thornless, than goodness.
Taste-wise the ones I've had so far were to my mind rather scented (if
you can understand that as a taste!). Rest are in the freezer, we'll see
what they are like through the winter.
My main gripe at the moment is that they seem to be a very vigorous
grower, more than doubling the size of the plant in a year (3rd year old
now). I wish more energy would be put into producing and swelling fruit.
I had similat problems with a Tayberry I tried years back, lots of
growth, but very little fruit.
--
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| On Sat, 22 Oct 2005 21:32:39 +0100, Anti-Spam wrote:
>WaltA
[color=darkred]
>I'll hold up my hand and say T'was I.
>I'm not offended,
Phew ! That's a relief
> I am trying them out, and this year we had quite a
>good crop. I was trying to find a berry that we had some years back in
>another garden, which was similar (but had awful thorns). The worcester
>is thornless, than goodness.
Very interesting, the ones I had were horribly thorny !
Duncan Gillespie in "The Winemaker's Garden" 1971 says
",,, but the berries take some picking for the bushes are even
thornier than goosberries "
I would have replied earlier, but I got distracted Googling on
Worcesterberries A random selection of sites also remark on their
thorns.
Which all sounds to be like the one you had "some years back" !!
The one you have now sounds to be much more user-friendly :-)
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On Sat, 22 Oct 2005 15:41:19 +0100, Jaques d'Alltradeswrote:
>
>That's not deviating, that's straight up, guv.
without hesitation !
miserably small, not a lot bigger than a fat blackcurrent, hairy,
similar to a mini-gooseberry, red to deep red (some but not me say
purple, even) !
but note what I said about thorns (or lack of) in another post, I
wonder if we are talking about the same animal (or protist  )
[color=darkred]
>. [45¾]
pardon ?
>[45¾] Just to keep it warm, you understand...
nope, I think I just overdosed on the Laphroaig,,,
clunk
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