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d-i-y'd compost bin questions.
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|
|
| Hi All,
A while ago we started a compost heap and a couple of months ago I
made a compost bin by cutting bottom out of a cheap plastic dustbin
and transferred the (small) heap to it.
Then a 'gardener' mate suggested I put some holes in the side so
drilled (using a tank cutter) a few round the top.
Now when we open the lid we find the bin is filled with hundreds of
tiny flies of some sort?
They don't seem to do us any harm (apart from being slightly annoying
when they all fly out on mass) but I wondered if they were doing any
harm in there?
Also I'd say the bin does smell a bit and not a nice 'composty' smell.
So far it's only had (old) fresh household vegetable scraps, tea bags,
fruit, egg shells etc?
I have forked it about a few times but not done much about wetting it
etc (not sure if I should etc).
Should I expect to see worms in there by now .. my Mum's bin is full
of them! ;-)
All the best ..
T i m
| |
|
| T i m <news@spaced.me.uk> writes
>Hi All,
>
>A while ago we started a compost heap and a couple of months ago I
>made a compost bin by cutting bottom out of a cheap plastic dustbin
>and transferred the (small) heap to it.
>
>Then a 'gardener' mate suggested I put some holes in the side so
>drilled (using a tank cutter) a few round the top.
>
>Now when we open the lid we find the bin is filled with hundreds of
>tiny flies of some sort?
>
>They don't seem to do us any harm (apart from being slightly annoying
>when they all fly out on mass) but I wondered if they were doing any
>harm in there?
>
>Also I'd say the bin does smell a bit and not a nice 'composty' smell.
>
>So far it's only had (old) fresh household vegetable scraps, tea bags,
>fruit, egg shells etc?
>
>I have forked it about a few times but not done much about wetting it
>etc (not sure if I should etc).
>
>Should I expect to see worms in there by now .. my Mum's bin is full
>of them! ;-)
>
It sounds like it's too dry.
Possibly too airy as well - if the stuff is too spread out in there,
it's difficult for it to stay moist. Things like cabbage stalks need
cutting up a bit before going in.
What I'd do next is water the whole lot, and then dump about 3 inches of
garden soil on top of it. That will cut down the smell as well as giving
another source of worms.
--
Kay
| |
|
| On Fri, 25 May 2007 22:48:04 +0100, K <k@scarboro.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>It sounds like it's too dry.
Hi and it could well be as I've not added any extra water to the 'mix'
;-(
>Possibly too airy as well - if the stuff is too spread out in there,
>it's difficult for it to stay moist.
The middle of the bottom of the dustbin was cut out (leaving a
reasonable 'rim') and is stood on plain earth. There are (now) about
10 x 20mm diameter holes around the top, just under the lid line (is
that enough / to many?). I have forked the contents about a few times
but it's sorta quite well packed in there (and never seems to fill
up!<g> ) apart from the surface, in between the lumpy bits etc.
> Things like cabbage stalks need
>cutting up a bit before going in.
Ah, ta. I have noticed some complete 'hearts' (is that what they call
them?) in there so I'll make sure they are chopped up next time.
>
>What I'd do next is water the whole lot, and then dump about 3 inches of
>garden soil on top of it. That will cut down the smell as well as giving
>another source of worms.
Ok and ta muchly. It actually started off as somewhere for kitchen
scraps so hasn't really had any true garden stuff in there as yet. I
did strim the front and back gardens today (well, my
next-door-neighbours gardens as we borrow them) so I have enough
matter to fill our little bin several times over. I'll have to get
some topsoil from somewhere as we don't have any 'surplus'. I don't
suppose a bag of the bought stuff would come with worms would it? I do
have a fairly big plastic planter that is full of soil (used for
French beans last year) would some of that do?
I'll put 'some' grass and soil in there as you suggest and give it a
drink. Apart from doing the boy thing (I keep forgetting) how much
water would I apply to a half filled std plastic dustbin would you say
please?
All the best ..
T i m
p.s. I'm not really a gardener, not into 'flowers' at all but do like
trying the 'produce' thing. To that end I have just planted 20 runner
bean (plants, started by a mate who is a 'professional' gardener). We
had quite a good crop last year and they are probably the only
vegetable I actually 'enjoy' (shredded and steamed). :-)
| |
|
| IT i m <news@spaced.me.uk> writes
>Hi and it could well be as I've not added any extra water to the 'mix'
>;-(
>
>
>The middle of the bottom of the dustbin was cut out (leaving a
>reasonable 'rim') and is stood on plain earth. There are (now) about 10
>x 20mm diameter holes around the top, just under the lid line (is that
>enough / to many?). I have forked the contents about a few times but
>it's sorta quite well packed in there (and never seems to fill up!<g> )
>apart from the surface, in between the lumpy bits etc.
Do you still have the bin standing the right way up? Because the idea is
to put it upside down (so it's wider and more open at the bottom than at
the top), then put the lid on what used to be the bottom. That way, to
fork it over easily, you just lift the bin off the pile. Also, it makes
a wider base for the worms to come up from below. But the fact that it
never fills up is a good sign. Worms like unshiny torn-up cardboard,
too, mixed in with the green stuff.
--
Klara, Gatwick basin
| |
| DavidG 2007-05-26, 3:25 am |
|
"T i m" <news@spaced.me.uk> wrote in message
news:bune53laiibdan81va8v3bs4thhsssl50d@4ax.com...
> On Fri, 25 May 2007 22:48:04 +0100, K <k@scarboro.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>
>
>
> Hi and it could well be as I've not added any extra water to the 'mix'
> ;-(
>
>
> The middle of the bottom of the dustbin was cut out (leaving a
> reasonable 'rim') and is stood on plain earth. There are (now) about
> 10 x 20mm diameter holes around the top, just under the lid line (is
> that enough / to many?). I have forked the contents about a few times
> but it's sorta quite well packed in there (and never seems to fill
> up!<g> ) apart from the surface, in between the lumpy bits etc.
>
>
> Ah, ta. I have noticed some complete 'hearts' (is that what they call
> them?) in there so I'll make sure they are chopped up next time.
>
> Ok and ta muchly. It actually started off as somewhere for kitchen
> scraps so hasn't really had any true garden stuff in there as yet. I
> did strim the front and back gardens today (well, my
> next-door-neighbours gardens as we borrow them) so I have enough
> matter to fill our little bin several times over. I'll have to get
> some topsoil from somewhere as we don't have any 'surplus'. I don't
> suppose a bag of the bought stuff would come with worms would it? I do
> have a fairly big plastic planter that is full of soil (used for
> French beans last year) would some of that do?
>
> I'll put 'some' grass and soil in there as you suggest and give it a
> drink. Apart from doing the boy thing (I keep forgetting) how much
> water would I apply to a half filled std plastic dustbin would you say
> please?
>
> All the best ..
>
> T i m
>
> p.s. I'm not really a gardener, not into 'flowers' at all but do like
> trying the 'produce' thing. To that end I have just planted 20 runner
> bean (plants, started by a mate who is a 'professional' gardener). We
> had quite a good crop last year and they are probably the only
> vegetable I actually 'enjoy' (shredded and steamed). :-)
Tim the flies are there becaue the recent additions to the bin are exposed.
Like Kay said -throw a bit of soil over the top. If thats not possible, use
paper shreddings or some torn up cardboard. (especially if you are about to
throw a lot of grass in)
I would chuck half to a full watering can in there first.
Also get a stick and make sure you wiggle a hole down the centre to let the
air in to the centre.
This is a good read : http://www.compostguide.com/
David
| |
|
| On Sat, 26 May 2007 07:41:33 +0100, Klara <klara.king@nospams.co.uk>
wrote:
Hi Klara,
>
>Do you still have the bin standing the right way up?
Yes ;-(
> Because the idea is
>to put it upside down (so it's wider and more open at the bottom than at
>the top), then put the lid on what used to be the bottom.
Understood. Because we were really only looking to deal with kitchen
waste and it's not actually our garden but our next_door_neighbours we
didn't want to tack the Mick with something too big or looking too
strange. This bin is just a cheap thinish plastic green jobby and
fairly parallel in section so although the hole in the top *is* bigger
than what I made in the bottom, not by a huge amount? Plus this way
the lid 'fits' and any that don't end up getting blown round the
neighborhood! ;-(
> That way, to
>fork it over easily, you just lift the bin off the pile.
The problem with that is it's sort of in a little niche between a shed
and a fence (but exposed to the South for suns rays pretty well all
day). To get it out I'd have to slip a spade under it and drag it out
onto the lawn (don't really have any spare earth areas to turn it over
either). I have 'modified' a long handled hand fork as a turning over
tool and that seems to work ok in this fairly small bin.
> Also, it makes
>a wider base for the worms to come up from below.
Understood.
>But the fact that it
>never fills up is a good sign.
Well that started when we just had a loose exposed mini pile and that
seemed to disappear as fast as we put things on it <g>. Because it was
a bit 'untidy' (and not our garden) I went for the bin, not realizing
that doing so would potentially change the dynamics of what was going
on quite so much!
> Worms like unshiny torn-up cardboard,
>too, mixed in with the green stuff.
Ah, well we haven't really been adding much (any) of that as we
re-cycle cardboard (and paper) separately. So, if we were to put some
cardboard in there what would you say was *best* (as we have quite a
choice and I know now 'non shiny'). What about shredded paper (from
the cross cut shredder) would that be a 'good' thing to add in small
quantities? And talking of paper (and considering this is quite a
small bin) *should* (rather than could) we put paper kitchen towel /
tissues in there please?
All the best and thanks for your help ..
T i m ;-)
p.s. In spite of not professing to be 'a gardener', last years runner
beans were in hot demand by friends and family! ;-)
| |
|
| On Sat, 26 May 2007 07:51:21 +0100, "DavidG" <nobody@nospam.com>
wrote:
>
>Tim the flies are there becaue the recent additions to the bin are exposed.
Ok .. (would they still be considered so if I hadn't drilled the holes
under the rim David?)
>Like Kay said -throw a bit of soil over the top.
Will do.
> If thats not possible, use
>paper shreddings or some torn up cardboard. (especially if you are about to
>throw a lot of grass in)
So would either of the latter be 'better' than soil (I guess not as
you said 'if that's not possible')? Also I'm not sure just how much
'grass' I should add considering this isn't a big container and I'd
rather not waste the space for the kitchen waste. Yesterdays 'grass'
cuttings are currently laying in a big pile (I found that my green
wheely bin wasn't empty like I thought <doh> ) and it was more like a
meadow than a lawn. Would some of that be 'better' than std lawn
trimmings?
>I would chuck half to a full watering can in there first.
Right ta. I did remember to pop down there myself this morning <weg>.
>Also get a stick and make sure you wiggle a hole down the centre to let the
>air in to the centre.
Hmm, so should I also drill some further holes around the general body
of the bin do you think David? So it looks like a brazier sort of
idea?
>This is a good read : http://www.compostguide.com/
It is indeed, that's for that!
All the best ..
T i m
| |
| Pam Moore 2007-05-26, 9:25 am |
| On Fri, 25 May 2007 20:30:28 GMT, T i m <news@spaced.me.uk> wrote:
>Hi All,
>
>A while ago we started a compost heap and a couple of months ago I
>made a compost bin by cutting bottom out of a cheap plastic dustbin
>and transferred the (small) heap to it.
>
>Then a 'gardener' mate suggested I put some holes in the side so
>drilled (using a tank cutter) a few round the top.
>
>Now when we open the lid we find the bin is filled with hundreds of
>tiny flies of some sort?
>
>They don't seem to do us any harm (apart from being slightly annoying
>when they all fly out on mass) but I wondered if they were doing any
>harm in there?
>
>Also I'd say the bin does smell a bit and not a nice 'composty' smell.
>
>So far it's only had (old) fresh household vegetable scraps, tea bags,
>fruit, egg shells etc?
>
>I have forked it about a few times but not done much about wetting it
>etc (not sure if I should etc).
>
>Should I expect to see worms in there by now .. my Mum's bin is full
>of them! ;-)
>
>All the best ..
>
>T i m
Did you turn the bin upside down?
If you do so, putting the wider part (tp rim) on the soil, there is
more soil surface in contact with the compost and also you can easily
lift the bin off to inspect the lowest contents.
I find this works very well.
Ants, flies etc will love it if it is warm and dry.
Try watering with "Recycled tea, coffee, beer", "kidney filtered" as
one Urgler said recently.
Pam in Bristol
| |
|
| On Sat, 26 May 2007 10:23:28 GMT, Pam Moore
<NOSpam.moore@NOSPAMvirgin.net> wrote:
Hi Pam in Brizzle ;-)
>Did you turn the bin upside down?
No I didn't. I cut (most of) the bottom out and left it at that, it
being pretty parallel and only 'small' in either case (it's about 3/4
the size of those big black dustbins) and was rally just to tidy up
the free form ground heap.
>If you do so, putting the wider part (tp rim) on the soil, there is
>more soil surface in contact with the compost and also you can easily
>lift the bin off to inspect the lowest contents.
I did think about that but because of the limited space I just
modified one of those cheap market telescopic hand forks as a 'muck
turner' and that seems ok so far (not as easy / efficient as with it
all on the ground but ..). ;-)
>I find this works very well.
Oh for the space (and my own garden Pam) ;-( When my
next_door_neighbour bought the place there was just a (rough) lawn and
a narrow border that had some scruffy flowers in. He let me widen the
strip, cover it with that black fabric stuff and put my bean canes in.
As long as I keep it tidy and don't take the mick he's not bothered.
He also drinks a lot of coffee but in spite of the offer I've never
seen any coffee grounds in my compost bin (but I have had to pressure
clear his drain of them once though). ;-(
>Ants, flies etc will love it if it is warm and dry.
Well it's just these tiny flies and one slug so far (he's probably in
there since I put crushed shells round my new runners) ;-)
>Try watering with "Recycled tea, coffee, beer", "kidney filtered" as
>one Urgler said recently.
Well I did the latter this morning (recycled tea, beer and gallons of
lemon squash .. not a good day for mowing the garden////// meadow
yesterday, very hot / sticky ..) and will give it all a turn about and
water a bit later.
Apparently a 'good sign' that 'something' is going on in there is that
in spite of adding to it fairly regularly it seems to be going down as
fast as we add to it .. and that's in spite of not having 'watered' it
at all (till now) and not having it in an ideal container?
All the best and thanks again ...
T i m
| |
| Gill Matthews 2007-05-26, 1:25 pm |
| In article <t2he53tjgnkjv0q8o0bifehjlak0t9nvk1@4ax.com>, news@spaced.me.uk says...
> Hi All,
>
> A while ago we started a compost heap and a couple of months ago I
> made a compost bin by cutting bottom out of a cheap plastic dustbin
> and transferred the (small) heap to it.
>
> Then a 'gardener' mate suggested I put some holes in the side so
> drilled (using a tank cutter) a few round the top.
>
> Now when we open the lid we find the bin is filled with hundreds of
> tiny flies of some sort?
>
> They don't seem to do us any harm (apart from being slightly annoying
> when they all fly out on mass) but I wondered if they were doing any
> harm in there?
>
> Also I'd say the bin does smell a bit and not a nice 'composty' smell.
>
> So far it's only had (old) fresh household vegetable scraps, tea bags,
> fruit, egg shells etc?
>
> I have forked it about a few times but not done much about wetting it
> etc (not sure if I should etc).
>
> Should I expect to see worms in there by now .. my Mum's bin is full
> of them! ;-)
>
> All the best ..
>
The flies sound like friut flies which are harmless to compost heaps.
Your compost might be a bit a bit damp with only veg scraps etc. We
bulk ours out with confidential shreddings.
Gill M
| |
| Pam Moore 2007-05-26, 1:25 pm |
| On Sat, 26 May 2007 11:23:04 GMT, T i m <news@spaced.me.uk> wrote:
>Apparently a 'good sign' that 'something' is going on in there is that
>in spite of adding to it fairly regularly it seems to be going down as
>fast as we add to it .. and that's in spite of not having 'watered' it
>at all (till now) and not having it in an ideal container?
That's good. Just wait till you get the good brown stuff out of the
bottom. Such a feeling of satisfaction!
Good luck from Brizzle!
Pam in Bristol
| |
|
| On Sat, 26 May 2007 15:39:20 +0100, Gill Matthews <Try the
sig@nospam.com> wrote:
>The flies sound like friut flies which are harmless to compost heaps.
Ok thanks Gill. I think I've also seen them inside the lid and at
first glance *some* of these insects look like silverfish (7mm long
and 1mm wide) , except they can fly?
>Your compost might be a bit a bit damp with only veg scraps etc.
Doh, and now I've added water (n stuff) ;-(
> We
>bulk ours out with confidential shreddings.
I've torn up some egg boxes and bog roll tubes and added some (long)
grass that I cut yesterday. I might go with your shredding idea as
that is something we need to 'get rid of'
When I was giving it a good stir earlier I noticed the bottom ~6" was
a fairly dark black, consistent 'stuff' and although I might have seen
a worm or two there were quite a few woodlice (and what may have been
the beginnings of an ant's nest). After giving it a good turn over it
all smelt a bit better as well. ;-)
All the best ..
T i m
| |
|
| On Sat, 26 May 2007 15:07:47 GMT, Pam Moore
<NOSpam.moore@NOSPAMvirgin.net> wrote:
>On Sat, 26 May 2007 11:23:04 GMT, T i m <news@spaced.me.uk> wrote:
>
>
>That's good. Just wait till you get the good brown stuff out of the
>bottom. Such a feeling of satisfaction!
I bet. I was explaining the 'boy watering' process (in passing so to
speak) to our 16yr old this morning .. she said she would be eating
out from now on! ;-)
>Good luck from Brizzle!
Thanks Pam ;-)
All the best ..
T i m
| |
|
| T i m <news@spaced.me.uk> writes
>On Fri, 25 May 2007 22:48:04 +0100, K <k@scarboro.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>
>
>
>The middle of the bottom of the dustbin was cut out (leaving a
>reasonable 'rim') and is stood on plain earth. There are (now) about
>10 x 20mm diameter holes around the top, just under the lid line (is
>that enough / to many?).
I don't think they'll make any difference one way or the other - it's
air in the body of the heap people seem to feel is important, ie holes
further down.
My compost heaps have solid wooden sides and do fine.
> I have forked the contents about a few times
>but it's sorta quite well packed in there (and never seems to fill
>up!<g> ) apart from the surface, in between the lumpy bits etc.
That all sounds good.
>
>
>Ok and ta muchly. It actually started off as somewhere for kitchen
>scraps so hasn't really had any true garden stuff in there as yet. I
>did strim the front and back gardens today (well, my
>next-door-neighbours gardens as we borrow them) so I have enough
>matter to fill our little bin several times over.
I think you'll find your problems are over.
>I'll have to get
>some topsoil from somewhere as we don't have any 'surplus'. I don't
>suppose a bag of the bought stuff would come with worms would it?
No!!!! Don't pay good money for anything to put on your compost heap!!!
>I do
>have a fairly big plastic planter that is full of soil (used for
>French beans last year) would some of that do?
Ideal.
>
>I'll put 'some' grass and soil in there as you suggest and give it a
>drink. Apart from doing the boy thing (I keep forgetting) how much
>water would I apply to a half filled std plastic dustbin would you say
>please?
I'd chuck a bucket full in. Doesn't matter if you overwater, as you're
open to the ground and any excess will drain away.
>
--
Kay
| |
|
| T i m <news@spaced.me.uk> writes
>On Sat, 26 May 2007 15:07:47 GMT, Pam Moore
><NOSpam.moore@NOSPAMvirgin.net> wrote:
>
>
>I bet. I was explaining the 'boy watering' process (in passing so to
>speak) to our 16yr old this morning .. she said she would be eating
>out from now on! ;-)
>
You should *never* mention bodily functions to teenagers. They are
ridiculously squeamish.
Having kids of their own generally sorts them out.
--
Kay
| |
|
| T i m <news@spaced.me.uk> writes
>On Sat, 26 May 2007 15:39:20 +0100, Gill Matthews <Try the
>sig@nospam.com> wrote:
>
>
>I've torn up some egg boxes and bog roll tubes and added some (long)
>grass that I cut yesterday. I might go with your shredding idea as
>that is something we need to 'get rid of'
Egg boxes, bog rolls tubes, corrugated cardboard are all good, as are
tissues and kitchen paper. Cereal boxes and other shiny cardboard will
rot down but take longer. In winter, my heap is 90% paper and cardboard.
Beware those little transparent windows in envelopes - they don't rot.
And fruit juice boxes, which have a layer of plastic under the
cardboard.
>
>When I was giving it a good stir earlier I noticed the bottom ~6" was
>a fairly dark black, consistent 'stuff' and although I might have seen
>a worm or two there were quite a few woodlice (and what may have been
>the beginnings of an ant's nest). After giving it a good turn over it
>all smelt a bit better as well. ;-)
I'd have fished the bottom 6inches out and used it ;-)
Make room for more new stuff.
>
--
Kay
| |
|
| On Sat, 26 May 2007 21:26:01 +0100, K <k@scarboro.demon.co.uk> wrote:
<polite snip>
>
>I think you'll find your problems are over.
<phew> ;-)
>
>
>No!!!! Don't pay good money for anything to put on your compost heap!!!
LOL. The trouble_is, some of us have boxes of spare computer parts or
lengths of metal turning stock and others have 'spare topsoil' ?
>
>
>Ideal.
Ok, I wasn't going to grow anything in that one this year anyway ;-)
>
>I'd chuck a bucket full in. Doesn't matter if you overwater, as you're
>open to the ground and any excess will drain away.
Ah, I was wondering about that .. so is the issue here to get
everything 'wet' without washing everything away?
All the best ..
T i m
| |
|
| On Sat, 26 May 2007 21:30:10 +0100, K <k@scarboro.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>T i m <news@spaced.me.uk> writes
>You should *never* mention bodily functions to teenagers. They are
>ridiculously squeamish.
;-)
Sfunny, this one isn't generally squeamish, does Tae Kwon-Do, rides a
trials motorbike, will happily pick up all sorts of creatures and hold
snakes and lizards all day long, but will she use the Port-Potti in
the (private) porch awning (just for a No1) on holiday when we are in
our folding caravan .. no, she'd rather walk across to the toilet
block in the pouring rain! <shrug>
>
>Having kids of their own generally sorts them out.
Indeed ;-)
All the best ..
T i m
| |
|
| T i m <news@spaced.me.uk> writes
>
>LOL. The trouble_is, some of us have boxes of spare computer parts or
>lengths of metal turning stock and others have 'spare topsoil' ?
And some of us have the whole lot (or our husbands do) ;-(
>
>Ah, I was wondering about that .. so is the issue here to get
>everything 'wet' without washing everything away?
That's exactly it.
I suppose the thing is to decide whether your compost is going to be a
source of nutrients or a soil conditioner. You're going to worry more
about leaching away nutrients if you want your compost to be full of
nutrients. I think compost is best regarded as a soil conditioner,
adding humus and aiding water retention, and making it easier to pull
out weeds.
--
Kay
| |
|
| >[color=darkred]
>Sfunny, this one isn't generally squeamish, does Tae Kwon-Do, rides a
>trials motorbike, will happily pick up all sorts of creatures and hold
>snakes and lizards all day long, but will she use the Port-Potti in
>the (private) porch awning (just for a No1) on holiday when we are in
>our folding caravan .. no, she'd rather walk across to the toilet
>block in the pouring rain! <shrug>
That's exactly what I mean. Outward manifestations of toughness coupled
with extreme wimpishness when confronted with emanations from human or
animal bodies.
Tae Kwon-do is no guarantee against squeamishness. I once had to rescue
a karate student - she was being held hostage in the changing room by a
centipede.
And it's not just a girl thing - a clutch of sub teenage boys scattered
as I carried the thing towards the door.
--
Kay
| |
|
| On Sun, 27 May 2007 14:06:02 +0100, K <k@scarboro.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>
>And some of us have the whole lot (or our husbands do) ;-(
Oh, and big houses and gardens .. <weg>
>
>That's exactly it.
Sweet ;-)
>
>I suppose the thing is to decide whether your compost is going to be a
>source of nutrients or a soil conditioner.
I spose I hadn't really considered it that far K ..
> You're going to worry more
>about leaching away nutrients if you want your compost to be full of
>nutrients. I think compost is best regarded as a soil conditioner,
>adding humus and aiding water retention, and making it easier to pull
>out weeds.
Ok (n thanks).
Well the black fabric stuff seems to have done a pretty good job of
keeping stuff away up till now with just a few blades of grass poking
through and a bit of bindweed running underneath since last year.
I popped into my gardener mates this arvo and we were discussing what
else I could safely start this year and we came down to maybe some
(batches of) spring onions (we have them in salads and stir-frys).
I'd like some broad beans but I'm not sure they are worth it (at least
with runners you eat the whole thing)?
Last year I had a few toms but they took a long time to turn red then
often split before you could get to them. What were more successful
(in taste if not quantity) where the tumbler toms my mate gave me in a
hanging basket.
I did get one cucumber off the two plants but the slugs took care of
the rest. I wonder if my Sisters runner ducks like slugs? ;-)
All the best ..
T i m
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| On Sun, 27 May 2007 14:09:57 +0100, K <k@scarboro.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>That's exactly what I mean. Outward manifestations of toughness coupled
>with extreme wimpishness when confronted with emanations from human or
>animal bodies.
So true!
>
>Tae Kwon-do is no guarantee against squeamishness. I once had to rescue
>a karate student - she was being held hostage in the changing room by a
>centipede.
<giggle>
>
>And it's not just a girl thing - a clutch of sub teenage boys scattered
>as I carried the thing towards the door.
Oooerr!
You didn't do what someone holding a spider typically does when they
see an Arachnophobia suffer K .. that open yer hand out and say
"Woooaaahhhhaaa" ? ;-)
All the best ..
T i m
| |
|
| T i m <news@spaced.me.uk> writes
>On Sun, 27 May 2007 14:06:02 +0100, K <k@scarboro.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>
>
>I'd like some broad beans but I'm not sure they are worth it (at least
>with runners you eat the whole thing)?
Oh, they're well worth it (assuming you like broad beans) - you pick
them slightly young, before the skins have had time to toughen up, and
they are delicious.
Climbing French beans are worth it, if you like them - they're so
expensive to buy and usually seem to have been flown in from Kenya.
In general, go for things you really enjoy which are expensive to buy.
I grow lots of fruit - it's more forgiving than veg. With things which
are grown in one season, you have to do things to timetable, whereas
perennial stuff can cope with things being delayed by a few weeks.
--
Kay
| |
|
| On Sun, 27 May 2007 23:47:05 +0100, K <k@scarboro.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>T i m <news@spaced.me.uk> writes
>
>Oh, they're well worth it (assuming you like broad beans)
I do, probably alongside peas and both behind runners ;-)
> - you pick
>them slightly young, before the skins have had time to toughen up, and
>they are delicious.
Ok. But am I too late to start some Broad beans now K, or can I get
them ready to put out (as I have via my mate and the runners)? Do they
climb up canes like runners?
>
>Climbing French beans are worth it, if you like them - they're so
>expensive to buy and usually seem to have been flown in from Kenya.
Ok. I had some dwarf beans as well last year but (not surprisingly) I
didn't get that many (or much should I say, as far as a meal goes
anyway).
>
>In general, go for things you really enjoy which are expensive to buy.
I enjoy cheap environmentally good transport so 'Bio diesel'! ;-)
>
>I grow lots of fruit - it's more forgiving than veg.
Is there any fruit you could grow in a border like strip do you think
please K?
>With things which
>are grown in one season, you have to do things to timetable, whereas
>perennial stuff can cope with things being delayed by a few weeks.
Ok, thanks for the tip.
I guess gardening is like many other things .. some do it for a
living (agriculture?) others do it for fun (and where sometimes it
seems money is no object). Others do it to try win prizes and others
(like me) dabble (stumbled into it [1]) and are happy to give anything
a try as long as there is a fairly high likely hood of some useable
results!
So far I think runners epitomize that for me. Anything that needs more
outlay / effort and I might as well buy it from the grocer in the
market?
All the best ..
T i m
[1] My gardener mate gave me the runner bean plants, the black
material and a pack of canes. ;-)
| |
|
| T i m <news@spaced.me.uk> writes
>On Sun, 27 May 2007 23:47:05 +0100, K <k@scarboro.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>
>
>Ok. But am I too late to start some Broad beans now K, or can I get
>them ready to put out (as I have via my mate and the runners)?
It's a bit on the late side - I don't know if others have sown them that
late? Some varieties can be sown in the autumn to overwinter and produce
an earlier crop. It's reckoned that planting either very late or very
early avoids blackfly, also pinching out the tips (which can be boiled
and eaten) once the plant is tall enough.
>Do they
>climb up canes like runners?
No, they're free-standing. Different genus. Runners and French are
Pahseolus, Broad are Vicia faba - which puts them in same genus a the
vetches most (all?) of which *are* climbing ;-)
>
>Ok. I had some dwarf beans as well last year but (not surprisingly) I
>didn't get that many (or much should I say, as far as a meal goes
>anyway).
Climbing crop more heavily, and seem to do better than runners if it's a
hot dry year. I like the round podded varieties like Blue Lake
If you get on with them you can have all sorts of fun with yellow and
purple podded ones too.
>
>Is there any fruit you could grow in a border like strip do you think
>please K?
If it's a wide border, rhubarb.
Raspberries - though they sucker. Blackberry hybrids (loganberries,
tayberries, boysenberries etc) - just need the fruiting stems cut out in
autumn and the new stems tying in. They're very vigorous, though. A
couple of apples (you need two for pollination) trained in a fan shape
so they don't take up much space back to front. Gooseberry. Strawberries
(beware of slugs and birds). Alpine strawberries - much smaller, more
intensely flavoured. If they like your soil they will spread like weeds,
so you can let them carpet the whole border and just remove them where
you want to plant something else. Fig in a buried container. Grapevine
trained along the fence if you're warm enough.
If you're not expecting to be in that place for more than a few years,
I'd go for one of the blackberry hybrids and the alpine strawberries -
you'll get a pretty quick return (cropping the year after planting). And
you could take the fig with you - but figs don't give a vast amount of
fruit compared with the space they take up.
>
>I guess gardening is like many other things .. some do it for a
>living (agriculture?) others do it for fun (and where sometimes it
>seems money is no object). Others do it to try win prizes and others
>(like me) dabble (stumbled into it [1]) and are happy to give anything
>a try as long as there is a fairly high likely hood of some useable
>results!
>
>So far I think runners epitomize that for me. Anything that needs more
>outlay / effort and I might as well buy it from the grocer in the
>market?
>
Some things are worth it for the taste of freshly picked. Strawberries,
broad beans, radishes, baby carrots for example.
Some things are worth the effort if you can't buy them commercially - eg
different varieties of apples, some varieties of veg which are noted for
their taste rather than their yield, rarer veg like salsify.
Remember you'll always have years when things don't do very well. Don't
let it put you off. I failed with aubergine last year - couldn't get the
plants going early enough.
--
Kay
| |
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| On Mon, 28 May 2007 10:06:46 +0100, K <k@scarboro.demon.co.uk> wrote:
>T i m <news@spaced.me.uk> writes
Firstly thank for such a detailed and informative reply K ;-)[color=darkred]
>
>It's a bit on the late side - I don't know if others have sown them that
>late? Some varieties can be sown in the autumn to overwinter and produce
>an earlier crop. It's reckoned that planting either very late or very
>early avoids blackfly, also pinching out the tips (which can be boiled
>and eaten) once the plant is tall enough.
Ok.
>
>
>No, they're free-standing. Different genus. Runners and French are
>Pahseolus, Broad are Vicia faba - which puts them in same genus a the
>vetches most (all?) of which *are* climbing ;-)
Technical stuff ..
Ok, well I seem to like most beans (inc 'butter' etc) so they might be
good. Do I just look for the seeds online or in a garden centre?[color=darkred]
>
>Climbing crop more heavily, and seem to do better than runners if it's a
>hot dry year. I like the round podded varieties like Blue Lake.
<Google> .. interesting .. once only grown for canning .. ~£1 for 20
I'll look out for them.
>
>If you get on with them you can have all sorts of fun with yellow and
>purple podded ones too.
I won't give our daughter the blue ones .. they might make her go
hyper (if they are like smarties etc) <weg>. The purple ones sound fun
and her favourite colour.
>
>If it's a wide border, rhubarb.
Well, at the moment it's about 1m wide with the 18 bamboo bean canes
towards the back about 30cm apart. Over the left half I also have some
extra canes nearer the front but leaning back and joining the others
via a 'cross bar'. Last year the runners were on the back and the toms
and cucumbers on the sloping fronts and the dwarf in the space at the
front right.
I also found / used 3 x 50cm round planters for tripods of runners
with more dwarf beans and some onions (to produce seed that I never
collected ;-( ) in-between.
We rarely have 'pudding' but would have some rhubarb if it was not too
tart and easy to grow?
>Raspberries - though they sucker. Blackberry hybrids (loganberries,
>tayberries, boysenberries etc) - just need the fruiting stems cut out in
>autumn and the new stems tying in. They're very vigorous, though.
That sounds a bit complicated K?
> A
>couple of apples (you need two for pollination) trained in a fan shape
>so they don't take up much space back to front.
Ok, that's a dwarf if they can be eating apples (probably my favourite
fruit).
> Gooseberry. Strawberries
>(beware of slugs and birds).
Not had either for ages. Not a 'strawberry' (or any berry) person
really if you know what I mean, rather have a big crisp apple ..
(although I dare say berries are good for you etc). I think the last
time I picked blackberries was with my parents when I was a kid (now
50)!
> Alpine strawberries - much smaller, more
>intensely flavoured. If they like your soil they will spread like weeds,
>so you can let them carpet the whole border and just remove them where
>you want to plant something else.
Ok, again, if they look after themselves K might be worth a try ..
> Fig in a buried container.
Not sure I follow that one .. I bury a pot of some sort in the ground
and grow a fig in there? What does that do please K?
>Grapevine
>trained along the fence if you're warm enough.
Nth London, fence N/S an I'm on the West side of it.
>
>If you're not expecting to be in that place for more than a few years,
>I'd go for one of the blackberry hybrids and the alpine strawberries -
>you'll get a pretty quick return (cropping the year after planting). And
>you could take the fig with you - but figs don't give a vast amount of
>fruit compared with the space they take up.
I have been here 30+ years now and can't see us moving for a while
(elderly parents nearby, Daughter about to go to local college, Wife
about to have a new knee etc).
>
<snip>[color=darkred]
>Some things are worth it for the taste of freshly picked. Strawberries,
>broad beans, radishes, baby carrots for example.
Ah, now that's were I think I loose out because I'm not sure I can
taste as most others do. The missus 'enjoys' the taste of most veg but
some taste like dirt (like baby corns) or just 'nasty' like broccoli
to me. I will eat a small amount of either 'because it's good for me'
but don't enjoy it unless actually disguised by a strong sauce etc.
'Apparently' broccoli (and similar things) contains a similar chemical
to artificial sweeteners and I can't stand that either. ;-(
>
>Some things are worth the effort if you can't buy them commercially - eg
>different varieties of apples, some varieties of veg which are noted for
>their taste rather than their yield, rarer veg like salsify.
Well I haven't tried that and would be willing to give anything like
that a go just to see if I can expand my eating choices. Maybe I'll
look for some of that in the green grocers first to see if I like it
before I waste growing space / time.
>
>Remember you'll always have years when things don't do very well. Don't
>let it put you off. I failed with aubergine last year - couldn't get the
>plants going early enough.
Yeah, I'm ok with that. Like the cucumbers and tomatoes. Cucumbers
taste pretty bland to me so wouldn't bother with them again (only grew
them because someone gave me the plants) and I have a mate with what
were commercial tomato houses [1] (before 'Europe' put him out of
business after 40 years) so 'good' tomatoes can be had by the box if I
want them (but I don't really, so end up giving them all away to
friends / family).
Maybe if we 'had' to be self sufficient I'd learn to appreciate the
taste of all this produce more ....?
All the best and thanks for giving me plenty to think about K!
T i m
[1] The insect squeamish 16yr old came with me to my mates tom houses
and at first wouldn't go in because they were full of bees (he buys
boxes of them to put in the houses) as she was stung by bees a couple
of times when young 'for no reason' etc.
She did venture in and after a few squeaks and ducks she actually got
used to the (big) things flying past her ears. He then gave her some
aphid cards to hang out but forgot to tell her what she was holding
.... (these were black aphid eggs that hatch and eat the white aphids
or sommat?). ;-)
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