quote:

---

>Has anybody had any experience with either of these software packages?
>I'm looking at PricePoint right now, cuz it seems to have everything
>Wintac does. Is there another similar software app that you prefer?
>Thanks in advance!
>
>Jeremy

quote:

---

> Those software packages do a nice job. However, in the class I teach
> on estimating, we dissected numerous flat-rate books.
>
> Almost every flat rate book is based on a fixed amount of time for the
> job.
>
> For instance:
> Water Heater - 2 hours.
> Expansion tank - .75 hours
> total time = 2.75 hours
>
> Materials = $300
>
> Then the excel program these flat-rate people keep does something like
> this.
>
> Materials = $300 x 50% markup = $450
> Time = 2.75 x 127.50/hour (your fill your own hourly price) = $350.63
> Overhead (most programs figure overhead at 25% of labor = $87.66
>
> So now you add those numbers
> Materials = $450
> Labor = $350.63
> Overhead = $87.66
> -------------------------------
> Total = 888.29
>
> I have a huge Excel database. I've offered to share it around here
> before with the request that others look it over and make suggestions.
> The numbers in that database come from several flat rate pricing
> guides, the national plumbing and hvac estimator books, and Plumbing
> Estimating Methods + a little common sense (some of the numbers
> published aren't reasonable.)
>
> In addition, the common sense is important. Who's going to pay you
> $888 to install a water heater when the folks at Lowe's and Home Depot
> will sell the water heater for $275 and then have installers to come
> out and install the thing for $150. If Lowes and Home Depot have
> installers who can offer a homeowner turnkey installation for $425,
> you're going to have a tough time getting $888 on that job. And yes,
> they'll call Home Depot and Lowes to compare pricing. So you have to
> some common sense and massage those numbers a little on some of the
> items listed.
>
> Everybody's so fucking tight-lipped with their pricing information. I
> don't know why. Here in Jamestown, NC we have guys charging anywhere
> from $50/hour up to $200/hour. We charge $127.50/hour to homeowners.
> We charge professional (property managers, contractors, etc)
> $87.50/hour. And we bill our time to choice customers at just $75/hour
> (choice customers are those guys who have enough work that you make up
> your price reduction because of high volume). In addition, when using
> a flat rate system, you'll find that a job that is listed for 1-hour
> might only take you 10-minutes to get it done.
>
>
>
> On Sat, 25 Jun 2005 23:02:06 GMT, Jeremy
> <jdplumb.geo@remove_yahoo.com> wrote:
>
>

quote:

---

> We are using Wintac as our basic management program. It has truly been a
> love hate relationship. Whenever you want to stretch the programs
> supposed
> capability it pisses you off. FOr the price you can't beat Wintac. The
> learning curve is easy. We have tried out two other programs in the last
> two months, that promised to do more than wintac. We got our money back
> on
> both.
>
> We used Collier Roachs flat rate program and linked it to wintac.
>
> We get $881 for a 50 gallon gas water heater. It comes with non-prorated
> 10
> year parts and labor, new dielectrics, pressure relief properly piped,
> new
> isolation valves, new gas cock, and disposal. If you don't want all of
> those features, or a brand name water heater, call the home depots. If it
> needs a fixin, I guarantee you'll never ever see the company again that
> installed it. That is the difference between a Home Depot install and a
> good install. You get what you pay for. This is the cheapest water
> heater
> we sell, and they sell daily. I even recommend the cust to call the home
> depots for a cheaper price, and they still have me install it!
>
> --
> Bob Pietrangelo
> bobp3@comcast.net
> bob@comfort-solution.biz
> www.comfort-solution.biz
> On Time or Your Service Call is FREE
> Preventive Maintenance Specialist
>
>
>
>
> "Blackbeard" <michael_curtis_young@lycos.com> wrote in message
> news:q41sb11jcj5govsritkq2711aqmmhp4r9m@4ax.com...
>
>

quote:

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>home depot has done a terrible disservice to our area by recommending the
>wrong products and giving BAD advice. They also carry parts that are not
>allowed by code and have told me not to bother with permits for jobs.
>
>
>"Bob Pietrangelo" <bobp3@comcast.net> wrote in message
>news:goqdnenOXODitSPfRVn-3g@comcast.com...
>

quote:

---

>We are using Wintac as our basic management program. It has truly been a
>love hate relationship. Whenever you want to stretch the programs supposed
>capability it pisses you off. FOr the price you can't beat Wintac. The
>learning curve is easy. We have tried out two other programs in the last
>two months, that promised to do more than wintac. We got our money back on
>both.
>
>We used Collier Roachs flat rate program and linked it to wintac.
>
>We get $881 for a 50 gallon gas water heater. It comes with non-prorated 10
>year parts and labor, new dielectrics, pressure relief properly piped, new
>isolation valves, new gas cock, and disposal. If you don't want all of
>those features, or a brand name water heater, call the home depots. If it
>needs a fixin, I guarantee you'll never ever see the company again that
>installed it. That is the difference between a Home Depot install and a
>good install. You get what you pay for. This is the cheapest water heater
>we sell, and they sell daily. I even recommend the cust to call the home
>depots for a cheaper price, and they still have me install it!

quote:

---

> So how are you arriving at that price of $881?
>
> I was just curious what sort of breakdown you were using. Does your
> software figure in your labor + material markup + overhead? And what
> numbers do you plug in for each part of the equation?
>
> I hear through others who have done work for Home Depot and Lowes that
> they figure in the cost of TWO fittings when their plumbers do an
> install (two couplings). Period. Surely that can't be that
> thick-headed. I can't imagine a licensed guy hanging his dick out
> there for Home Depot or Lowes, getting paid LESS than his normal rate,
> AND increasing his liability (100% liability falls on the plumber) to
> follow some ludicrous out-of-touch corporate policy. Have I been
> misinformed?
>
>
> On Sun, 26 Jun 2005 00:01:09 -0400, "Bob Pietrangelo"
> <bobp3@comcast.net> wrote:
>
supposed[vbcol=seagreen]
on[vbcol=seagreen]
10[vbcol=seagreen]
new[vbcol=seagreen]
it[vbcol=seagreen]
heater[vbcol=seagreen]
home[vbcol=seagreen]
>

quote:

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>
> The only work we do we do not make any money on is for Seniors and
> Reservists in Iraq. Those we will do 1-2 per week for free. We still price
> the invoices as if we were charging full price, but give them a total
> discount. I them let my accountant figure out how to write it off.

quote:

---

> I have a huge Excel database. I've offered to share it around here
> before with the request that others look it over and make suggestions.
> The numbers in that database come from several flat rate pricing
> guides, the national plumbing and hvac estimator books, and Plumbing
> Estimating Methods + a little common sense (some of the numbers
> published aren't reasonable.)

quote:

---

>Blackbeard wrote:
>
>I would be interested in checking out your spreadsheet database. Send it
>to me by email if you want at jdplumb dot geo at yahoo dot com. And
>thanks in advance!

quote:

---

> I've tried making a spreadsheet flat rate list
>before, but I get frustrated at setting it up so that any changes in
>pricing (material or labor, markup, etc.) can be automatically figured
>in w/o going through and modifiying each and every assembly. BTW, I'm
>currently examining PricePoint and so far I'm not happy with it. For
>one, you can't easily add items not already in the database. Also, the
>interface is really confusing. There's no way to just look at a list of
>anything. It's fixing to go back, I think. We may try Wintac next.
>