Electrical code Compliance - The status of engineers in the UK

Author

The status of engineers in the UK - 10 Downing Street's online petition

clementer@cantv.net

2007-02-27, 3:25 am

I have been made aware of the following petition which I forward for
information and action if you so wish.

Astronautics engineer Jon Jennings has this week leapt on the online
petition bandwagon to call for the title of "engineer" to be a
protected title. Jennings has joined an escalating list of people
using 10 Downing Street's online petition trial to drum up support for
his campaign to restore respect in engineers.

"Car mechanics, plumbers and electricians are now commonly referred to
as engineers and banks now regard engineers as semi skilled," says his
petition.

So if you are a British citizen or resident and you agree that the
status of the engineer is undervalued in the UK society sign the
petition:

http://petitions.pm.gov.uk/Engineer-Status/

Enzo Matrix

2007-02-27, 8:25 pm

clementer@cantv.net wrote:
> I have been made aware of the following petition which I forward for
> information and action if you so wish.
>
>
> Astronautics engineer Jon Jennings has this week leapt on the online
> petition bandwagon to call for the title of "engineer" to be a
> protected title. Jennings has joined an escalating list of people
> using 10 Downing Street's online petition trial to drum up support for
> his campaign to restore respect in engineers.
>
> "Car mechanics, plumbers and electricians are now commonly referred to
> as engineers and banks now regard engineers as semi skilled," says his
> petition.
>
>
> So if you are a British citizen or resident and you agree that the
> status of the engineer is undervalued in the UK society sign the
> petition:
>
> http://petitions.pm.gov.uk/Engineer-Status/

The petition calls for only "Chartered Engineers" to use the job title
"engineer" and also specifically mentions IMechE and RAeS.

But what about those of us who have IEng status, rather than CEng? When I
had EngTech status, I was happy to abide by the EC rules and refer to myself
as a "technician". I worked hard to gain IEng status and to earn the right
to call myself an engineer. Does Mr Jennings wish to deny me that title?

I agree that the term "engineer" should be a protected ttle. However, I
don't think that Mr Jennings has put enough thought into his proposal.

--
Enzo

I wear the cheese. It does not wear me.

Andrew Gabriel

2007-02-28, 3:25 am

In article <HPCdnW2QGI37VnnYnZ2dnUVZ8tqqnZ2d@giganews.com>,
"Enzo Matrix" <enzo55@hotmail.com> writes:
>
> The petition calls for only "Chartered Engineers" to use the job title
> "engineer" and also specifically mentions IMechE and RAeS.
>
> But what about those of us who have IEng status, rather than CEng? When I
> had EngTech status, I was happy to abide by the EC rules and refer to myself
> as a "technician". I worked hard to gain IEng status and to earn the right
> to call myself an engineer. Does Mr Jennings wish to deny me that title?
>
> I agree that the term "engineer" should be a protected ttle. However, I
> don't think that Mr Jennings has put enough thought into his proposal.

He seems to want to blame a lack of training and respect for
engineers on lack of a protected title, and I just don't buy
that at all. The protected titles exist, as in CEng, BEng, etc
already. Car mechanics, train drivers, etc always were called
Engineers. When a title is awarded protected status, it always
allows continued use of current common uses. For example, to
be called an Architect, you need to be appropriately qualified
and recognised by the Royal Institute of Architects, or you need
to be performing a trade which was already using that term prior
to the legislation coming into force, such as a landscape
gardener. Similarly for a doctor, anyone with a PhD in anything
can use the term as that was common practice before the title was
protected. So a protected title wouldn't stop any of the other
roles currently calling themselves from doing so, although it
might stop any further expansion of the use of the term.

As you say, the proposal doesn't seem to have been thought out.

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

d&tm

2007-03-06, 3:25 am

"Andrew Gabriel" <andrew@cucumber.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
news:45e5262e$0$761$5a6aecb4@news.aaisp.net.uk...
> In article <HPCdnW2QGI37VnnYnZ2dnUVZ8tqqnZ2d@giganews.com>,
> "Enzo Matrix" <enzo55@hotmail.com> writes:
I[color=darkred]
myself[color=darkred]
right[color=darkred]
>
> He seems to want to blame a lack of training and respect for
> engineers on lack of a protected title, and I just don't buy
> that at all. The protected titles exist, as in CEng, BEng, etc
> already. Car mechanics, train drivers, etc always were called
> Engineers. When a title is awarded protected status, it always
> allows continued use of current common uses. For example, to
> be called an Architect, you need to be appropriately qualified
> and recognised by the Royal Institute of Architects, or you need
> to be performing a trade which was already using that term prior
> to the legislation coming into force, such as a landscape
> gardener. Similarly for a doctor, anyone with a PhD in anything
> can use the term as that was common practice before the title was
> protected. So a protected title wouldn't stop any of the other
> roles currently calling themselves from doing so, although it
> might stop any further expansion of the use of the term.
>
Are you implying that a PhD is less worthy of the Dr title? a medical
doctor only has bachelor degrees, why should they call themselves a doctor
if they dont have a doctoral level degree.? And why do they deserve a title
in front of their name? ie we dont call people Engineer Smith or Scientist
Jones. Typical anti academic bias being shown with your comment "a PhD in
anything". I dont really think "the thing" being studied has anything to do
with the quality of the research. The end result is that a PhD properly
earned has actually contributed to knowledge rather than just learnt what
others have taught them and passed exams. Worthy of some special status I
would have thought.
terry

Enzo Matrix

2007-03-06, 9:25 am

d&tm wrote:
> "Andrew Gabriel" <andrew@cucumber.demon.co.uk> wrote in message
> news:45e5262e$0$761$5a6aecb4@news.aaisp.net.uk...
> Are you implying that a PhD is less worthy of the Dr title? a medical
> doctor only has bachelor degrees, why should they call themselves a
> doctor if they dont have a doctoral level degree.? And why do they
> deserve a title in front of their name? ie we dont call people
> Engineer Smith or Scientist Jones.

You *can* ... There is a prenominal title "Eur Ing" or "European Engineer".
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Euring

--
Enzo

I wear the cheese. It does not wear me.

Andrew Gabriel

2007-03-06, 5:25 pm

In article <45ed2606_1@news.iprimus.com.au>,
"d&tm" <tfmann@iprimusREMOVEME.com.au> writes:

> Are you implying [...]

No.
You seem to have imagined a whole load of things which I
neither said nor implied. Try reading what I actually wrote,
without trying to apply some strange imagined meaning of
your own on top of it.

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

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