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> If you have a mediocre or hard to sell property you may need to hire an
> agent. But if you have a sought-after property you shouldn't need to.
> FSBO is not worth anything, and you don't need them.
>
> 1) put up a web page with complete info and photos of every room and
> amenity
> 2) put an ad in the paper with the web address
> 3) list the property at 4-5% below market (agent-market that is)
> 4) Give it a month or 2
>
> Think of your advantage if you can knock off $50K from the house next
> door and still walk away with the same or more money? At the high end,
> you can assume that anyone with that kind of money is reasonable
> internet savvy. Or at least they have a kid who is.
>
> Signing an agreement with a broker is totally foolish. Remember that if
> you find a FSBO on your own, you have a bargaining position that you
> don't have with a broker. If its a hot property you're going to pay
> market or close anyway. But if the seller doesn't have to pay the
> broker,and you are ready to buy, cash-in-hand, you can get a piece of
> that 4-6% overhead yourself. It costs money for every month the seller
> doesn't sell without a broker for advertising, carrying costs, etc, so
> if you can buy quickly you can get a bargain.
>
> Unless of course you're willing to pay $50K for a glorified chauffer.
>

quote:

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> I didn't really mean that FSBO was "useless". I meant that its no
> threat to the RE business in general, because its too loosely marketed
> and not presented very well. The problem is that there are too many
> sites like FSBO. The advantage that brokers have is that they have a
> single listing network. If you have a mediocre property it could take
> forever to sell it on FSBO.

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> Hi,
> Sorry for coming on a bit strong, but I genuinely belive this might

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> understand one of the key components in your success. Remember, the

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> successful people do not do everything themselves. They are good at

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> their team. If you believe real estate is a place to secure your

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> your Realtor might be the most important choice you can make.
> If saving $50K were as easy as finding a buyer then you would be

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> there would be no need to pay brokers. For some reason, even with all

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> comission pressure brought on by sub-standard agents the real estate
> brokerage business model is stronger than ever.
> On average 82% of FSBOs fail to sell. If the FSBO gets into escrow,

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> take about three times longer to do so, they are four times less

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> close and six times more likely to suffer litigation. Of those who

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> escrow, their net proceeds will average 5 to 12% less and about 90%

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> not do it again.
> To your credit, the "glorified chauffer" you refer to represents about

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> 95% of the real estate agent community. Some are inexperienced, while

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> are rookies year after year. However, there are those of us who can,

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> manner of speaking, "chauffer" you in an airplane, on a dark stormy

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> foggy night, avoid traffic and hazards, prevent and solve malfunction,
> navigate, communicate, delegate and observe a schedule, all without

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> your drink. If there is any glory in that, it would be simply that the
> client arrived at their destination in a safe and timely manner. Care

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> give the pilots seat a go?
> Though our job is to make it look easy, its not! There is no basic
> transaction anymore. Modern transactions are deceptive because of the

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> of issues they present and they demand an experienced professional to
> deliver them in a safe and timely manner (all without spilling your

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> A professional broker has no shortage of savvy and successful clients

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> to enlist their services. The question is can you find the right

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> The following is an excerpt from my personal brochure, I hope this

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> to be more successful:
> In the past, agents controlled access to real estate information and

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> were relatively simple. Many agents were able to get away with average
> service and many buyers and sellers (justifiably) felt agents were

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> easy money.
>
> In today's market with public access to real estate information via

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> internet, agents no longer control information. However, the complex

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> detailed nature of a modern transaction demands a much higher standard

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> client representation.
>
> Today's market places much greater emphasis on agent skill level and
> professionalism than ever before. The standards by which the most

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> agents are judged are: Integrity, experience and results. Market,

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> and financing knowledge. Marketing, negotiation and accounting skills.
> Closing coordination and risk reduction ability.
>
> By aligning yourself with the right real estate professional you will

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> an entire team at your disposal.
>
> Do you deserve these qualities when hiring your agent?
>
> Ken Ward, Broker, REALTOR, ABR, GRI, Licensing Instructor
>
> RE/MAX Realty Group, Ashland OR
>
>

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>I didn't really mean that FSBO was "useless". I meant that its no
> threat to the RE business in general, because its too loosely marketed
> and not presented very well. The problem is that there are too many
> sites like FSBO. The advantage that brokers have is that they have a
> single listing network. If you have a mediocre property it could take
> forever to sell it on FSBO.
>

quote:

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> In today's market with public access to real estate information via the
> internet, agents no longer control information. However, the complex
> and
> detailed nature of a modern transaction demands a much higher standard
> of
> client representation.

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> Of course it is. The NAR is very protective and is the only thing
> keeping realtors from being totally useless. Its like a big union using
> its clout to keep useless workers on the payroll. What would a RE
> broker be without the MLS? Just an uneducated old lady with a nice car
> (covers head).
>
> The public thinks of RE agents the way they think of Credit Card
> companies. A friend of mine tried to start an FSBO-type biz before
> there was such a thing, and even though he was offering free listings
> until he got started, people just hung up on him when he called. People
> are so paranoid of scams and rip-offs that they'd rather pay the Re-max
> guys because at least they know they're legit. They have worldwide
> stupidity going for them.
>

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> Dont be an fool. Obviously you only call people who have FSBO ads the
> paper. Its not like you're going to cold-call random people. But they
> get so many calls from rabid RE agents looking for the listing they get
> numb.
>
> I think I've made the point that the reason FSBOs don't sell well is
> because its crappy marketing. Most people are idiots, so they need
> help. If you're not an idiot then you don't need a broker. If people
> can find a broker, they can find your house. Brokers put their phantom
> listings in the paper to draw buyers into their office. You can do just
> as well advertising your property in the same medium.
>

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> Buyers can't find them because buyers agents don't show them, so buyers
> have to find them by driving randomly around the neighborhood and scouring
> the classifieds.

quote:

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> "Jeff Strickland" <crwlr@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:DKidnYcRbaw59VjfRVn-1Q@ez2.net...
>
>
> If that is true, and I suspect it is, then so-called "buyer's agents" do
> not really represent the best interests of buyers. It seems to me they are
> more like friendly sales people, who are willing to show you around a
> store and help you find a few good products, but are not willing to show
> you everything that meets your needs, certainly not the products in the
> discount store across the street.
>

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> Fine. Set out on your own to buy a house in a city you are not familiar
> with, in neighborhoods where you have no idea what's going on. When you
> tire of driving around aimlessly week after week, let us know.

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>
> If that is true, and I suspect it is, then so-called "buyer's agents" do
> not
> really represent the best interests of buyers. It seems to me they are
> more
> like friendly sales people, who are willing to show you around a store and
>
> help you find a few good products, but are not willing to show you
> everything that meets your needs, certainly not the products in the
> discount
> store across the street.

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>
> Yes, I agree; someone who sets out to buy a house in a strange city,
> either
> with or without the help of an agent, is in a very weak position and prone
>
> to financial loss. For someone relocating to another city, I think a lot
> is
> to be said to renting for the first year while becoming more familiar with
>
> the neighborhoods, house prices, etc. But for the vast majority of people
> who are house-hunting in their own familiar city, I would suggest exactly
> what you say: Drive around a lot, not aimlessly but systematically, and
> look
> at what is available.

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> I'm curious as to how that works. From the buyers view (say
> realtor.com), I've never seen an MLS listing where you could contact
> the seller directly. Does the "sponsor" agent get the contact info? If
> buyers can't contact you directly, then the value is substantially
> diminished. Heck, the sponsor agent should pay the fee for you.

quote:

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>
> On 3-Jul-2005, "Steve" <tm4525@aol.com> wrote:
>
>
> All a savvy seller needs to know is the address or owner's name. From
> that
> they can go to the tax rolls or one of the many online directories and
> get
> the owner's phone number or simply knock on the door..
>

quote:

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> "Jeff Strickland" <crwlr@yahoo.com> wrote in message
> news:35ednT6HIq2fSFjfRVn-ow@ez2.net...
>
>
> Yes, I agree; someone who sets out to buy a house in a strange city,

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> with or without the help of an agent, is in a very weak position and prone
> to financial loss. For someone relocating to another city, I think a lot

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> to be said to renting for the first year while becoming more familiar with
> the neighborhoods, house prices, etc. But for the vast majority of people
> who are house-hunting in their own familiar city, I would suggest exactly
> what you say: Drive around a lot, not aimlessly but systematically, and

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> at what is available.
>
>

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>
> A Buyer's Agent that is worth a shit can do the driving for you, and he is
> paid by the seller.

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> The
> main problem my wife and I encountered was that they did not show us all
> the
> available properties that met our needs. We found what we were looking by
> driving around ourselves, with a little help from internet searches.

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> The reason you weren't being shown all the properties is the one's you
> weren't shown were probably listed though a discount broker and paid a
> very
> low commission, were FSBO, or it's getting to where there's many buyer's
> agents that won't show a house if it is listed with no photos. The idea is
> if you don't want to truly hire a buyer's agent and sign a contract with
> them. At least to go on realtor.com and insist on them showing you the
> properties you're interested in. If they drag their feet, call the listing
> agent direct. The listing agent will even pick you up and drive you there
> with bells on being that they'll be getting the full commission.

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> On average 82% of FSBOs fail to sell. If the FSBO gets into escrow, they
> take about three times longer to do so, they are four times less likely to
>
> close and six times more likely to suffer litigation. Of those who close
> escrow, their net proceeds will average 5 to 12% less and about 90% would
> not do it again.

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>
> On 27-Jun-2005, "Ken Ward" <kward541@charter.net> wrote:
>
to[vbcol=seagreen]
would[vbcol=seagreen]
>
> Where exactly did you get those statistics?
>

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> to
> would
>
> Steve, I think these are national numbers, I don't think they hold true,
> or
> quite so true, in California where you and I are. I can't support them,
> but
> I have seen them, or numbers like these, before.
>
> As you are well aware, the decision to go it alone with a FSBO is highly
> dependent on the market for success. Here in California, I think that
> FSBOs
> have greater success than many other places, a large part of that is
> because
> escrow does more here than in other states. I know that I had to do more
> on
> my purchase and my sale because I went it alone, but I was able to work
> well
> with escrow on both transactions. The escrows in both said that I was
> among
> the better customers they worked with, most people simply are not well
> suited to deal with this sort of stuff. Certainly many are, but there is
> no
> denying that many aren't.
>
> This discussion started off as a look at using a Buyer's Agent, the fact
> that we are discussing the pitfalls of selling shows how much confusion
> there can be.

quote:

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>
> On 8-Jul-2005, "Jeff Strickland" <spamcatcher@yahoo.net> wrote:
>
>
> I'm in South Florida not CA. But the situations seem to be similar. From
> what I've seen, there's no way I'd wouldn't use the MLS to sell my home.
> My
> best friend, a Realtor of 20 years sold her home with a yard sign and was
> so
> proud she got her asking price in two weeks. Fact is, she asked too low.
> Within two weeks after she sold an identical townhouse sold on the MLS for
> 20k higher! When I worked for Buy Owner I would sign up at least two
> Realtors per month. It amazes me that even Realtors succumb to the ego
> trip
> and greed factor of thinking they can do better selling it themselves.
>

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> Steve, your statement "FSBO is not worth anything" is simply not true.
> I sold through FSBO
> and I am glad that I paid $350 instead of $4200 for an agent. I am
> thinking of becoming a
> broker myself. However, I am thinking it deeper as I am seeing signs of
> "For Sale By Owner"
> more and more. It is not just FSBO. People are just selling by
> themselves by putting up a sign.

quote:

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> I didn't really mean that FSBO was "useless". I meant that its no
> threat to the RE business in general, because its too loosely marketed
> and not presented very well. The problem is that there are too many
> sites like FSBO. The advantage that brokers have is that they have a
> single listing network. If you have a mediocre property it could take
> forever to sell it on FSBO.

quote:

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> Steve, I don't know if you are a broker or not but I wish I could agree
> with you as I am an aspiring broker myself. When you say "single
> listing network", I guess you are talking about MLS. FSBO put my house
> on MLS for $300 and my total cost was $350. That is the biggest
> problem.

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> Hey, that deserves a blue ribbon. It sounds like the same hot air that
> NAR publishes in their ads in an attempt to convince both buyers and
> sellers that it's a really tough job. I especially like that part
> about :
>
> 1. financing knowledge. Yup, pick up the phone and call your mortgage
> broker friend and dump it in his lap.
>
> 2. accounting skills. Yup, you gotta know if your commission check
> was written for the right amount.
>
> 3. closing coordination. Yup, just find a reliable title company and
> they will take care of all of that for you.
>
> 4. risk reduction ability. I guess that means to just lay low till
> the title agent closes the deal, so you reduce the risk of screwing
> things up and losing your commission check.

quote:

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> The system won't let just anybody access it via Internet, so I don't think
> it's as public as it seems to you. I mean, being a part of this system you
> probably got used to it to the point that you don't realize it's a
> closed/members-only system, but as a part of that *public* I can assure
> you: access to listings outside the FSBO domain is NOT PUBLIC.

quote:

---

> Of course it is. The NAR is very protective and is the only thing
> keeping realtors from being totally useless. Its like a big union using
> its clout to keep useless workers on the payroll. What would a RE
> broker be without the MLS? Just an uneducated old lady with a nice car
> (covers head).

quote:

---

> People
> are so paranoid of scams and rip-offs that they'd rather pay the Re-max
> guys because at least they know they're legit.

quote:

---

> Brokers put their phantom
> listings in the paper to draw buyers into their office. You can do just
> as well advertising your property in the same medium.

quote:

---

>
> If that is true, and I suspect it is, then so-called "buyer's agents" do
> not
> really represent the best interests of buyers.

quote:

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> Did you sign anything? If you signed a disclosure you should have read it.
> If you didn't common sense should tell you that if you don't have a
> contract
> you don't have commitment. Or would you have the commitment be one sided?
> Did you just fall off the turnip truck or something?

quote:

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>
> Some so-called "buyer's agents" try to give the impression they are
> representing a buyer when no contract exists. All those Sunday supplements
>
> in the newspapers that describe the real estate scene and new developments
>
> need to publish more columns explaining the legalities of the relationship
>
> between home buyers and the various agents with which they deal.

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> agent will feel morally obligated to the buyer even though they are
> legally
> obligated to the seller.

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> In practice the buyer's
>
> If this is true, it is certainly unlike any business relationship I have
> encountered. If it is true, how do you suppose the seller feels about it?
>
> Car salesman to customer in sales room: Sir, I am morally obligated to
> you,
> even though I am legally obligated to my boss.